Letter of Reference

[CasperTFG]

Do employers still ask for these? If so how should I go about getting them.

My current employer has a strict policy that no manager or otherwise is permitted to give out a letter of reference for any reason. If one is required it is prepared by H.R. and basically resembles a Record of employment. Basically it says, "Mr/Mrs. _______, Worked with the corporation from Start date to End Date."





Casper

There is room for all of gods creatures, "Right Beside the Mashed Potatoes".

 

[Dollie]

I've never seen an employer specifically ask for one. I've had people ask for one when they leave a company, and I have also seen companies offer them when the person is being laid off. The main reason for this is to state clearly that the person either left of their own will or left because of reasons beyond their control, and eliminates any idea that the person left for reasons other than those.

Letters of reference normally contain just the basic information as you stated. When employers go beyond basic employment information, they are entering unknown waters where they are not quite sure what can come up from the depths to bite them. Personal opinions and viewpoints about the referred person are usually not found in letters of reference.

Also, most potential employers will pick up the phone and check your references, regardless of what letters are produced.

 

[EBGreen]

Thst is standard for most companies due to liability issues. You could still get personal letters of reference from friends and associates.

[red]"... isn't sanity really just a one trick pony anyway?! I mean, all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you are good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit!" - The Tick[/red]

 

[Glenn9999]

Yes, employers still ask for letters of reference. And it's a nightmare too.

I got kicked out of consideration for the last job I applied to for that very reason. They wanted, a resume, an application filled out, and THREE letters of reference. All I could tell them was "sorry no can do", and they said "sorry, you aren't in consideration".

 

[CasperTFG]

So your suggesting to get letters of reference from Friends then? I could do that.



Casper

There is room for all of gods creatures, "Right Beside the Mashed Potatoes".

 

[EBGreen]

I don't know that I would say I was suggesting that, I'm just saying that getting them from employers is nigh on to impossible, so firends may be your only choice if they are required.

[red]"... isn't sanity really just a one trick pony anyway?! I mean, all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you are good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit!" - The Tick[/red]

 

[Glenn9999]

So your suggesting to get letters of reference from Friends then? I could do that."

The problem with that is they usually do want them from work-sources. Ex-managers, ex-coworkers, stuff like that. From my understanding, usually when something like three references is asked, one is usually allowable to be a character reference. Not from your friends, necessarily, but those who have no interest in you and can attest to your character. Your buddy John might not work, but the pastor of your church or the lead person of the charity you volunteer for would.

 

[EBGreen]

I agree that the higher the community standing of the personal reference the better.

[red]"... isn't sanity really just a one trick pony anyway?! I mean, all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you are good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit!" - The Tick[/red]

 

[MDXer]

The way I handle this is on my Resume I have under References Avaliable upon request. I've worked for companies that had the standard Refference letter too, but that doesn't stop you from asking your boss/co-worker if you can use them as a reference which usually is done as a phone call. Many of the people I know and work with do not provide a list of references up front out of respect for the person providing the reference. You don't want people being slammed with phone calls about you just because you're looking for a job. Also using this approach you can garuntee for the most part who provides the reference and therefore the quality of the reference. Depending on the company size and who you know you could possibly get them from pretty high up the ladder. I've recieved them from as High as COO CKO and CEO along with a number of VPs doing it this way.

Shoot Me! Shoot Me NOW!!!
- Daffy Duck

 

[SF0751]

In the past, I've asked ex-managers and ex-coworkers to write letters of recommendation for me. However, the letters were written on their personal stationary, not on company letterhead (so that they would not be "official" company letters). The letters would state our working relationship ("Susan was employed as a widget-inspector, and reported directly to me for 3 years"). I would take copies of these letters with me to interviews and would offer them towards the end of the interview. ("Thank you for giving me the opportunity for this position - here are three letters of recommendation from my former managers/coworkers for your review". DON'T state that the letters are from your former employer, because they're not.)

Susan
"'I wish life was not so short,' he thought. 'Languages take such a time, and so do all the things one wants to know about.'"
- J. R. R. Tolkien, The Lost Road

 

[EBGreen]

Even if the manager did it on their personal stationary, HR and Legal would come down on them like a ton of bricks in most of the companies I've worked for.

[red]"... isn't sanity really just a one trick pony anyway?! I mean, all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you are good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit!" - The Tick[/red]

 

[CasperTFG]

Yup, as I said the Company policy here is that no Manager or the Like is allowed to give out a reference of any kind.

Casper

There is room for all of gods creatures, "Right Beside the Mashed Potatoes".

 

[Thadeus]

While this probably doesn't help Casper (as a programmer), I wanted to offer my thoughts on references.

As an applications consultant I picked up a few customers that got to know me pretty well. Some would thank me profusely for my efforts, knowing I would work tirelessly for their interests. A few offered the line, "If there is ever anything I can do..." I learned to take them up on it, asking them to write a short blurb to my manager. This they would usually copy me on.

When I was leaving my employer (caught in dot-bomb lay-offs), some of those customers once again offered, "If there is ever anything I can do, feel free to give me a call... references, whatever."

So once I had left my employer, I called and asked them if they would mind my using their blurbs in my new job searches. I received unanimous consent.

Here are two such blurbs that I include on a single sheet reference page (which is only available on request). The Names have been changed to protect the innocent .

[b]Customer References:[/b]

“Thad's attention to detail, patience and instant teaming with our staff made for three of the most seamless upgrades we have ever experienced. Thad would be an asset in any client relations team.”

Susie Rockefeller
Director of Telecom
[Fortune 100 company name here - IT company]
123-456-7890


“Thad has been an invaluable source to us.  As a user, I didn't always know the technical reasons behind some of the issues I was having.  Thad was always available to explain in a way that I could understand without being condescending.”

Craig Masters
Assistant Vice President
Resource Planning and Customer Service
[Fortune 100 company name here - financial company]
123-456-7890

~Thadeus

 

[Thadeus]

Another note, and this one may help Casper out:

I include the names of my former managers who are no longer with my former employers.* This avoids many of the legal issues, but allows my future employers to hear directly from those who have hired and managed me in the past.

~Thadeus

*If they offer and subsequently consent, of course.

 

[grande]

Does anyone else think it's nuts that Susie Rockefeller and Craig Masters have the same phone number?!?!?!



-------------------------
Just call me Captain Awesome.

 

[damber]

yeh - I tried calling but I think my phone must be broke...

A smile is worth a thousand kind words. So smile, it's easy!

 

[langleymass]

There is a great deal of cover-your-butt here. This is why they generally say as little as possible. One person called one of my former supervisors, and he responded: "Talk to HR."

 

[langleymass]

References are somewhat overrated anyway. Once a manager told me this: "If it's somebody I want to get rid of, I tell them he's the greatest employee in the world.

 

[CasperTFG]

That is true... No way my current Manager would want to loose me, but then again I don't want him to know about it until I am gone.

As the old Irish toast goes, "Here's hoping that you pass the gates of Heaven 10 minutes before the Devil knows your gone".

I do have several VP's that I know who would offer Personal References, as well as an old director that retired last year. However he husband still works with us so have to be careful there to not approach her until it is a for sure thing.

Casper

There is room for all of gods creatures, "Right Beside the Mashed Potatoes".