IT Recruiting Firms

[imterpsfan3]

I've had the unpleasant experience of dealing with IT Recruiting firms of late and have wondered if it's just me or recruiters in general. It seems to me they are like used-car salesmen. Or they give you ridiculous BrainBench tests that have no particular relevance to a real IT job and base their interest on that. They pester you to death until the interview process is over and then afterwards don't give you a straight answer about what's going on.

Since I already have a job, it's not a big deal to get the run around. But I've experienced this all too many times with recruiters.

Instead of dealing with IT Recruiting Firms is it better to deal post a resume here or on Monster?

 

[mrdenny]

From what I have seen recruiters SUCK!!!

I have run accross a good one. Just the one. The rest were worthless. This one recruiter actually kept in touch for about a month after I started to make sure that everything was going well and that I was setteling in, and even took me to lunch to congradulate me on getting the job.

Every other one that I have run accross was a waste of time. It got to the point that after going to do the required meet and greet my wife would ask me "Was that another waste of time?". Now I'm a fairly optimistic person and most of the times I had to answer "Yep, I'll never be hearing from them again".

I keep my resume posted on Monster. That's how I've been found for the last few jobs I've had.

Be very carefull with the recruiters. They will screw you out of a job if they aren't going to get paid for it. I was taking out of the running for a job because some other recruiter that I didn't know was sending out my resume. The really crappy recruiters work like this.

They get your resume from Monster, dice, etc. Anywhere they can. They blast fax it to every company with an opening for any position hoping for a call. The problem is that if you end up getting a job from a company that they faxed your resume to the hiring company has to pay them as well as the recruiter that actually got you the interview.

Because of this it's just easier to pass on the reference and not do the interview.

Some tips I've kind of figured out:
1. Keep your name and address confidential on Monster and Dice. Use the built-in services to keep people from getting your actual email address and name until you specifically give it to them. Recruiters that I've talked to are not offended by this.

2. If the recruiter is one of those chain recruiters where the office is nothing more than a large conference table with like 3 shared computers and a bunch of people that don't know what they are talking about, don't even bother. It's probably a waste of time.

3. Talk to friends about recruiters they have worked with in the past that were good.

4. Swing by the local user group for your specific part of IT and see who some of those guys recommend.

5. Let the recruiter do the Salary stuff. They are probably better at it then you, and have a vested interest in getting you more money. (When I got this job, the recruiter got me what I wanted even though it was 10k more than the max the company said they were willing to pay).

6. Be honost with the recruiter. Make sure they know what your strengths and weeknesses are. That way they only send you for the right interviews. If you have something bad in your best, let them know. They can help figure out if it will be a problem, and help you spin it so it doesn't look so bad.

7. I just don't trust the guys that want you to pay them. I stick with the recruiters that the company pays.

I know I had one more good point, but now I can't remember it. If I can I'll post it later.

Denny
MCSA (2003) / MCDBA (SQL 2000)

--Anything is possible. All it takes is a little research. (Me)

http://www.mrdenny.com

(Not quite so old any more.)

 

[imterpsfan3]

Ok, the strange thing that happened was that I was sent on two different interviews. The recruiter raved about how great my interviews went and kept pressuring me to tell me which one I preferred right on the spot. The one job was temp to perm, which didn't thrill me. I wanted permanent. He even said the place had recommended me for the job. Then after I said I wanted to think about it over the weekend, he basically stopped all communication with me. When I called on the phone he said he was busy and then also wouldn't return any emails. I asked him what was going on and he wouldn't give me an answer. This is Spherion. Anyone else dealt with them?

 

[Stella740pl]

Also take a look at thread654-1064593 on a similar topic.

 

[imterpsfan3]

Has anyone ever had to deal with those ridiculous BrainBench tests that some recruiting firms give you before "they can move on with an opportunity". Most of the questions weren't relevant to what a programmer/developer would do in a real live project. The scary thing is that they place a great deal of trust in these tests.

Can someone give me a list of legit recruiting firms?

Thanks in advance.

 

[mrdenny]

What part of the country/world are you in?

Denny
MCSA (2003) / MCDBA (SQL 2000)

--Anything is possible. All it takes is a little research. (Me)

http://www.mrdenny.com

(Not quite so old any more.)

 

[imterpsfan3]

I'm actually equi-distant from Baltimore and DC. But the DC metro area has a lot more tech jobs than Baltimore.

 

[mrdenny]

I can't help you much then. I'm in the Los Angeles area (Orange County actually).

Denny
MCSA (2003) / MCDBA (SQL 2000)

--Anything is possible. All it takes is a little research. (Me)

http://www.mrdenny.com

(Not quite so old any more.)

 

[Glenn9999]

Has anyone ever had to deal with those ridiculous BrainBench tests that some recruiting firms give you before "they can move on with an opportunity".

Sure I've dealt with every bit of ridculousness imaginable on interviews, from logic tests, to math tests, to spatial orientation tests. All ridiculous. As was most of the interview processes.

I've basically learned that "ridiculous" is the correct word to describe how interviews and recruiting goes in most if not all IT.

 

[chiph]

When I do interviews, I bring a laptop and ask the candidate to write some code. Or explain what's going on in a UML diagram, depending on their experience level and what the job is for.

I never ask stupid stuff like "What's the third parameter to the FooBar event when the user has the left mouse button depressed?"

Chip H.


____________________________________________________________________
If you want to get the best response to a question, please read FAQ222-2244 first

 

[imterpsfan3]

When you say "write some code"... you are looking for pages of code in a class module, data access layer, etc?

 

[MDXer]

I never ask stupid stuff like "What's the third parameter to the FooBar event when the user has the left mouse button depressed?"

I worked at a place where we did team interviews and one of the app developers would ask these types of questions until he unwittingly interviewed someone who had once been a part time compsci instructor and not only knew the answers but also the why. It was probably the funniest and best interview I was ever involved in.

Shoot Me! Shoot Me NOW!!!
- Daffy Duck

 

[imterpsfan3]

Well, the funny thing is that I was grilled by a team of developers for a job that would involve migrating asp applications to asp.net. I tend to not use datasets and like to use unbound applications with data readers, modify records with stored procedure commands. They kept asking me about datasets, as if one should only use them.

I then found out it was the same job that this same recruiting firm, different recruiter, talked about last year with me. The time before they had sent my resume over but not interviewed.

The software manager wanted me to send him some code samples. Since I don't send out code for projects I've worked on, I had to come up with something on the fly. At least they were trying to gauge my technical skill. What do you all feel about asking the interviewer/s a tough technical question to see what THEY know or is that too tactless?

They didn't seem like jerks or anything. It was the recruiter I had a problem with.

 

[chiph]

When you say "write some code"... you are looking for pages of code in a class module, data access layer, etc?

It depends on the skill level the job requires.

For data access code, I'll have a database & tables set up, and ask them to write me some CRUD operations (hopefully they know what CRUD stands for). The bare minimum I want is that it compiles cleanly. I usually don't care if it brings back any rows -- I want to watch them work, see how they navigate through the help -- or if they use the help at all -- I'd rather they used the help rather than sit there & struggle to remember something. And see if they put any exception handling in, that sort of thing. I then ask them to explain it back to me.

For a senior level position, I'll have written some code ahead of time that more or less works and compiles cleanly, and ask them what I did wrong. If they say I did everything perfectly, I'll end the interview right then. That means they didn't see my design mistakes (there's always a few that I put in intentionally and there's usually a few unintentional ones!) Or the other possibility is that they don't have strong opinions about how things are done, in which case they're a worker bee, and not a true senior programmer who can lead and mentor others.

I suspect that my criteria is vastly different from what most people encounter when interviewing. ;-)

Chip H.


____________________________________________________________________
If you want to get the best response to a question, please read FAQ222-2244 first

 

[chiph]

They kept asking me about datasets, as if one should only use them.

Sounds like the only thing they've learned, they've picked up from the tutorials and from magazines.

That would be a dangerous job to take. If you upset their worldview too much, you'll make them uncomfortable. And doing that makes you expendible.

It'd probably be OK as a contracting job, though, as they would expect a contractor to know more than they do. But they'd probably still expect you to do it their way, no matter how inefficient.

Chip H.


____________________________________________________________________
If you want to get the best response to a question, please read FAQ222-2244 first

 

[imterpsfan3]

Chip, actually I like your style of interviewing.

 

[chiph]

It has the advantage of quickly separating out those who say they can program from those who really can.

Hiring the wrong person is a truly expensive mistake that I've seen happen over and over.

Not only is there the cost of paying the recruiter fees (if any), but also the effect of their negative productivity on the team. In addition there's the emotional impact of telling someone that they're just not working out at the new job they had such hopes for. Probably just after they put a downpayment on a new house or car, too. :-(

Chip H.


____________________________________________________________________
If you want to get the best response to a question, please read FAQ222-2244 first