Is there a foolproof way to increase print quality of text? I am scanning menus at 600dpi and reorganizing them in Photoshop CS to fit my format size. Some originals are better than others. The output pt size varies from 7pt. to 12pt. Is there a way to obtain sharper text and or convert the whole file to a vector in CS? Can I convert to vector and then reduce the dpi in half to sharpen the text? I am at the mercy of used menus with food stains, therefore I use higlights and levels to remove large areas of "copy dirt" and then touch up using other tools.
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[highlight]Text Of Scanned Image Rasterized[/highlight] 1
- Thread starter KWM
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Wow! That's a lot of questions!
I'll just ask/mention a couple of things then let someone much wiser take over:
reorganizing them in Photoshop CS to fit my format size
So does that mean you are resampling up, resampling down, changing ppi or just moving things around at the size they are at?
Resampling down is usually not too much of a problem. Use Bicubic Sharper in CS for a nice result. Resampling up will always look worse. If you are just moving things around at the same size everything should be fine...just make sure you are using cmyk or rgb mode.
Is there a way to obtain sharper text and or convert the whole file to a vector in CS?
No and no...but yes and yes. There are no "hey presto" buttons to press. There are various ways of converting scans to vectors, but in the instance of text I would say that you will always get a horrible result by any method. But of course you can trace/redraw/retype text in Illy if you want a vector.
Can I convert to vector and then reduce the dpi in half to sharpen the text?
Again we are talking PPI, but never-the-less, once you have a vector of the image there is no need to ever be concerned by PPI. Print quality of a vector is determined by the printer (and this time we are talking DPI)
can anyone tell me why my tags are showing up in the topic area?
Just as a guess I would would say tags don't work in topic starters.
Is there a foolproof way to increase print quality of text?
So to sum up...if you are talking about scanned text...I would say "no".
Resampling down may help a little. But at 100% or larger I would generally say "no". (sure you can try Unsharp Mask etc...but in my limited experience I've never found anything too pleasing)
I'll just ask/mention a couple of things then let someone much wiser take over:
reorganizing them in Photoshop CS to fit my format size
So does that mean you are resampling up, resampling down, changing ppi or just moving things around at the size they are at?
Resampling down is usually not too much of a problem. Use Bicubic Sharper in CS for a nice result. Resampling up will always look worse. If you are just moving things around at the same size everything should be fine...just make sure you are using cmyk or rgb mode.
Is there a way to obtain sharper text and or convert the whole file to a vector in CS?
No and no...but yes and yes. There are no "hey presto" buttons to press. There are various ways of converting scans to vectors, but in the instance of text I would say that you will always get a horrible result by any method. But of course you can trace/redraw/retype text in Illy if you want a vector.
Can I convert to vector and then reduce the dpi in half to sharpen the text?
Again we are talking PPI, but never-the-less, once you have a vector of the image there is no need to ever be concerned by PPI. Print quality of a vector is determined by the printer (and this time we are talking DPI)
can anyone tell me why my tags are showing up in the topic area?
Just as a guess I would would say tags don't work in topic starters.
Is there a foolproof way to increase print quality of text?
So to sum up...if you are talking about scanned text...I would say "no".
Resampling down may help a little. But at 100% or larger I would generally say "no". (sure you can try Unsharp Mask etc...but in my limited experience I've never found anything too pleasing)
Converting scanned text to vector would take forever!
You could use OCR to scan the original menu as plain text, and use a page layout package to re-typeset it (PS isn't really suitable for this).
Alternatively, convert your cleaned up / re-formatted text to bitmap mode to get the crispest text. If you want to do this, start with a very high resolution scan, and don't be put off by how bad it might look on screen. Of course, if you have other graphics, you'll have to scan them separately or they'll look really bad!
You could use OCR to scan the original menu as plain text, and use a page layout package to re-typeset it (PS isn't really suitable for this).
Alternatively, convert your cleaned up / re-formatted text to bitmap mode to get the crispest text. If you want to do this, start with a very high resolution scan, and don't be put off by how bad it might look on screen. Of course, if you have other graphics, you'll have to scan them separately or they'll look really bad!
If you don't have OCR then scan at the absolute highest resolution you have got. Even 600 dpi is too low for most text, esp if it is only 7 pt.
It's probably better to bite the bullet and redo the text component in something other than PS.
It's probably better to bite the bullet and redo the text component in something other than PS.
mscallisto
Technical User
Yes there are a lot of questions so I contribute to the last one.
Instead of highlights, levels, curves Etc. can you try the following?
If you do have multiple menu's can you do multiple menu scans and place them on multiple layers then layer mask to replace spaghetti stains with another clean layer from a menu with a wine stain in different place?
Instead of highlights, levels, curves Etc. can you try the following?
If you do have multiple menu's can you do multiple menu scans and place them on multiple layers then layer mask to replace spaghetti stains with another clean layer from a menu with a wine stain in different place?
- Thread starter
- #7
You guys are so funny. <sarcasm> I am at the mercy of
?management? I am lucky to get one menu copy. More often than not, I'm expected to make changes from an old version, minimal typesetting allowed. Last edition was produced via copy machine and cut & paste (yes, I mean WAX!) New mandate is 100% electronic with no guidance, training or warning. Only, here's Adobe Suite, perform magic. No kidding, I went from Photosop LE 4, Pagemaker6.5 to Adobe CS in 2 months. I have a lot of catching up, bear with me.
THANKS FOR ALL YOUR HELP!!!!!!!!!!
P.S> Anybody hiring?
?management? I am lucky to get one menu copy. More often than not, I'm expected to make changes from an old version, minimal typesetting allowed. Last edition was produced via copy machine and cut & paste (yes, I mean WAX!) New mandate is 100% electronic with no guidance, training or warning. Only, here's Adobe Suite, perform magic. No kidding, I went from Photosop LE 4, Pagemaker6.5 to Adobe CS in 2 months. I have a lot of catching up, bear with me.
THANKS FOR ALL YOUR HELP!!!!!!!!!!
P.S> Anybody hiring?
KWM
I don't think there's any need to be sarcastic. We were not provided with the additional information you supplied in your most recent post. We answered on the basis of the original info supplied.
>>More often than not, I'm expected to make changes from an old version, minimal typesetting allowed.<<
You have my sympathies, but if you were expected to update the old menu from one stained copy of the original, then your boss certainly cannot expect perfection. If you had PM and Photoshop, there's no reason why you couldn't have scanned into PS, cleaned up all the stains and even the erased the text, bring it as a TIF into PM and reset the text. It's still probably the best option you have.
>>New mandate is 100% electronic with no guidance, training or warning. Only, here's Adobe Suite, perform magic.<<
PS still works in much the same way, except it's got more bells and whistles (and probably overkill for the sort of work you have decribed). ID is a bit more of a challenge and if you are still experiencing problems, go over to the Adobe User to User forums where they have a forum specifically for InDesign. Good luck, and you have my sympathies for having such a d**khead for a boss.
I don't think there's any need to be sarcastic. We were not provided with the additional information you supplied in your most recent post. We answered on the basis of the original info supplied.
>>More often than not, I'm expected to make changes from an old version, minimal typesetting allowed.<<
You have my sympathies, but if you were expected to update the old menu from one stained copy of the original, then your boss certainly cannot expect perfection. If you had PM and Photoshop, there's no reason why you couldn't have scanned into PS, cleaned up all the stains and even the erased the text, bring it as a TIF into PM and reset the text. It's still probably the best option you have.
>>New mandate is 100% electronic with no guidance, training or warning. Only, here's Adobe Suite, perform magic.<<
PS still works in much the same way, except it's got more bells and whistles (and probably overkill for the sort of work you have decribed). ID is a bit more of a challenge and if you are still experiencing problems, go over to the Adobe User to User forums where they have a forum specifically for InDesign. Good luck, and you have my sympathies for having such a d**khead for a boss.
- Thread starter
- #9
Eggles,
So sorry for this miscommunication. I was attempting to show sarcasm at my situation, not the valuable advice. My thanks at the end was "sincere". Yes, bossman is all that and more.
I am not at liberty to typset, unless approved by customer. They are charged addtionally for any typeset (makes not a bit of sense to me either, shouldn't quality be key?) Anyway, OCR would technically not be typsettting and I have tried this approach. Most menus have artwork screened behind text or text is of such poor quality that OCR gets confused. Long shot - do you know if Text Bridge Pro has a filter to omit non text background images? I couldn't find any reference. Or, know of a better OCR program?
Best regards,
KWM
So sorry for this miscommunication. I was attempting to show sarcasm at my situation, not the valuable advice. My thanks at the end was "sincere". Yes, bossman is all that and more.
I am not at liberty to typset, unless approved by customer. They are charged addtionally for any typeset (makes not a bit of sense to me either, shouldn't quality be key?) Anyway, OCR would technically not be typsettting and I have tried this approach. Most menus have artwork screened behind text or text is of such poor quality that OCR gets confused. Long shot - do you know if Text Bridge Pro has a filter to omit non text background images? I couldn't find any reference. Or, know of a better OCR program?
Best regards,
KWM
I don't have any experience with Text Bridge. I have used Omni Page and found it to be pretty good. However, most of the stuff I OCR is usually fairly clean anyway, so doesn't present much of a challenge.
Do you ever get the opportunity to speak directly with clients or is the boss always the middleman? If you can speak to the client about jobs where the text is particularly poor, perhaps try discussing with them the improvement in presentation if they paid for new typesetting. I know you know all this already, and I am aware of your frustration.
I also have to deal with customers who want us to just print their stuff (I work in a small printshop) and it is just screaming out at me to make some improvement to it before printing, but I am not allowed to, for the same reasons as you. Customer doesn't want to pay for it - OR - even worse, woulld feel insulted if I suggested their own work could be improved upon.
Such is our lot in life.
Do you ever get the opportunity to speak directly with clients or is the boss always the middleman? If you can speak to the client about jobs where the text is particularly poor, perhaps try discussing with them the improvement in presentation if they paid for new typesetting. I know you know all this already, and I am aware of your frustration.
I also have to deal with customers who want us to just print their stuff (I work in a small printshop) and it is just screaming out at me to make some improvement to it before printing, but I am not allowed to, for the same reasons as you. Customer doesn't want to pay for it - OR - even worse, woulld feel insulted if I suggested their own work could be improved upon.
Such is our lot in life.
- Thread starter
- #11
Well, I hate to admit it but it is reassuring that I am not alone in this throw it together/who cares world. Wish it were the opposite.
Just experimented with the new OCR packaged with HP's new line of scanners (didn't catch the name) Very pleased with it. It did an admirable job reading text in columns and placing it in the proper readability order. Impressive! Will attempt one of my dirty menus tomorrow.
Revolt against poor graphics. Maybe this industry is in need of some unionization and quality standards. I mean really, does anyone read a quarter page ad with forty lines of 7 pt. type? Unfortunately, I have been forced to do many of these. Pitiful.
Thanks again to everyone. I have increased my speed and knowledge in just the few short weeks I have been reading here. Very helpful. Where can I get my hands on printed manuals of Illustrator, Indesign and Photoshop. I prefer to read for comprehension but I gather that manuals are no longer printed. At least I didn't get any with Adobe CS. Can they still be purchased?
Just experimented with the new OCR packaged with HP's new line of scanners (didn't catch the name) Very pleased with it. It did an admirable job reading text in columns and placing it in the proper readability order. Impressive! Will attempt one of my dirty menus tomorrow.
Revolt against poor graphics. Maybe this industry is in need of some unionization and quality standards. I mean really, does anyone read a quarter page ad with forty lines of 7 pt. type? Unfortunately, I have been forced to do many of these. Pitiful.
Thanks again to everyone. I have increased my speed and knowledge in just the few short weeks I have been reading here. Very helpful. Where can I get my hands on printed manuals of Illustrator, Indesign and Photoshop. I prefer to read for comprehension but I gather that manuals are no longer printed. At least I didn't get any with Adobe CS. Can they still be purchased?
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