HARD DRIVE LOCKUPS!! HELP!! PLEASE!!

[j3ffr3y]

Ok so I've gone thru like 5 hard drives in the last year, usually each time I get Disk Read Error or it wont even try to detect it in bios. I read a recovery book with IT suggestions where they talked about heads locking up etc. and they said to take the hard drive out and drop it flat on its surface, so I did it today when I experienced another one of these lockups and it worked.. My question is why is this happening and how can I avoid it?

I usually have things constantly downloading and uploading, and the comp runs 24hrs a day, some times I go 5 or more days before I restart and I'm using Xp Pro. I thought maybe it could be from leaving the comp running 24/7 but I figure servers run 24/7 so why cant my HD? I've gone thru maxtor's, Western Digital's, such a pain. Can some one PLEASE HELP!!?!?!

 

[garebo]

First thing i can say is that if you had to use the "drop" method to get the hard drive unlocked, then it is going to fully lock up one day soon and it wont ever unlock again.
So the first thing to do would be to get all your data you want to save off of that hard drive right away.
So you have s.m.a.r.t active on your computer? If you have s.m.a.r.t. and it is enabled, it will tell you your hard drive is going bad. You can check on this in your bios and see if s.m.a.r.t is there and if its enabled or disabled, if its disabled then enable it and it should tell you there is a problem with this hard drive. However, if you had to do the "drop" to get it going, its pretty certain the drive is going to go bad permanently soon, sorry to say.

This is usually a heat related problem which could have many causes.
Sometimes its a matter of too many parts in a small case and not enough airflow, maybe not enough fans, maybe the fans not in the right place, maybe the fans not blowing in the right direction. You need to give us more info on your system. However, if its a few years older then your airflow should go like this. A fan should be in the front at the bottom of the case with air coming into the case.
Then there should be a fan at or near the top pushing air out of the case. The power supply fan should also be pushing air out of the pc.
But since you are having problems with your hard drives then it could be a "dead" space. That means a place in your pc where no air is being moved around and your hard drive is running all the time and overheating on you.
If you have the space you can put a "cooler" or special fan made special for hard drives on your hard drive, but its likely too late for the one you have.
Somehow, somewhere, you probably have an airflow problem in your pc and it may be compounded by a too small case and\or air not getting to your hard drive. We would need much more info to be able to help you, but i think you can get a pretty good idea from this.
Can you give us the info on your system?








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[j3ffr3y]

Thanks, so you think its heat related? Its an older system 800mhz pro1200 board with close to 800mb of RAM. The only fans in the case are for the power supply and processor, but I do keep the side of the case open and my house is usually cold. Is this not enough cooling? I've been wanting to build a new pc for some time now, but with these HD problems I wasnt sure if it was related to the PC itself, or if I run my HD's too hard for long periods of time or what.. so you definately think its heat related? I will activate s.m.a.r.t today.

 

[j3ffr3y]

ok so I tried to restart to activate s.m.a.r.t and that was it! disk read error ;[ no amount of dropping was going to bring it back this time. I wish I had backed up more data. Anyway, I'm definately going to build a new PC I cant take this anymore! do you think it could be something with the mother board? I changed the IDE cables so its not that, I want to build the new PC so that this never happens again.. So assuming it is heat killing it and not the mother board I think I'll build the new PC with 2 hard drive coolers

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1457115&CatId=495

then I'll take a flame thrower to my current PC!

 

[garebo]

Only judging by what you said, it very certainly seems and sounds like a heat problem, but it seems to be a heat problem aimed directly at the hard drive.
So the hard drive must be in a "dead zone", an area that isnt getting any airflow in or around it. This is where the hard drive coolers come in.

An 800 mhz cpu doesnt really require anything but a heatsink\fan on it and all is well.
So, again, its the position of the hard drive in your case and the fact that there doesnt seem to be enough airflow to it, plus the fact that you run it 24/7, its all of these things.
One more thing, if you have your settings set up so that the hard drive runs all the time, and not just when needed, that would help cause your heat buildup on your hard drive as well. So that may be a 4th item, but i dont know what settings you have.

Whenever you have smart in your bios you should turn it on. It doesnt interfere, all it does is check your hard drive on startup and does a fast analysis to let you know in advance if the hard drive has any problems with it. If there are problems then you get time to save your data.

You can also put the hard drive in the freezer for about 6 or more hours and put it back in and often it will run again until it heats up. Sometimes you can get your data off the drive that way. But as soon as it heats up it will fail. If you do that wrap it in tinfoil and then a baggie to keep moisture out before putting it in the freezer.
The freezer method shrinks the metal enough so that there is a gap between the head and the platter, at least until it heats up again. Thats what i believe i read about how it works, something like that.



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[G0AOZ]

The fact that the hard drive is running 24/7 should not be an issue. As you say, servers run continuously, and I have two machines here which run 24/7/365 and have done so for several years.

You don't say what size/speed of hard drive you've been using. Generally the bigger and faster ones get hotter. For instance, I've found that a 40Gb (7200) Maxtor runs considerably hotter than a 30Gb (5400) Maxtor.

As Garebo has suggested, a hard drive cooler is a good idea, or failing that just place a 60 or 80mm fan in front of the drive.

ROGER - G0AOZ.

 

[garebo]

The only reason i mentioned about the 24/7 is that heat problems would cause more damage to a hard drive that is run 24/7 as opposed to a hard drive that is only used, say, an hour a day. So the damage done by heat would show up sooner with a h drive thats run 24/7. Plus, if the os is set so that the hard drive never rests when not needed, this causes heat issues to come sooner than later. Its a mixture.

However, if there is good fan usage, no dead air spots, and the hard drives get enough air then, of course, the computer and hard drives can run 24/7 with no problem. But when the hard drive doesnt get the air flow it needs, it will overheat and die.


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[j3ffr3y]

Thanks for all the replies guys! ok heres the latest news, when I hook either drive up (that locked) as Slave I can access it and browse folders, but when I get to MyDocuments/*MainUser*/ I get ACCESS DENIED. But I can go into all the other folders, the problem is all my files are in MyDocuments/*MainUser*/ so what I did was use FileRecovery and it lets me go into the folder thru that program and recover files. Now my question is, is this some how a Windows related problem? If the drive is truely locked why am I able to access it to a certain extent?

So the good news is I'm recovering my files from the Slave drive as we speak, but now its got me wondering..

 

[garebo]

I think this goes along with you having a heat related problem. When the h drive is cold you can access it, but when its hot you cant.
The problem with the files in your my documents is likely that that area got messed up badly due to the heat issues, messed up worse than the other areas.
Get what you can get off of that drive as its gonna die on you soon.

Tell me, is your current pc in a small case?

You mentioned building a new unit. The point is that you have to build a unit with cooling in mind. Bringing cool air in the bottom front and pushing hot air out the back at the top is pretty much standard. Some of the very newest systems are starting to require even more specialized cooling than that.


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[micker377]

When you look at a newer case, you will note that the default position for the hard drive is near the bottom. You will also see that it is close to the mounting of the "intake" fan. This is for proper cooling of the hard drive.

 

[garebo]

Im starting to think you are thinking there is more to this. There isnt. You yourself, in your post describe 5 hard drives going south on you. You pointed out you used the "drop" method to revive the last drive. This is an indication of an overheated drive.
You pointed out that when you activated smart it told you there was an error, possible indication of overheated drive, definite indication the drive is failed or failing.

The fact that you can access some but not all of the files on the drive only means the whole drive hasnt failed completely yet, but the drive will certainly fail you soon, if its not unusable at this time. I doubt there is any other reason.

All of these things point to the very likely event that all 5 hard drives have suffered from too much heat on a 24/7 basis. They would have lasted longer had they not been on 24/7 but still there seems to be a heat problem.

Its very likely been a heat issue. So you want to make sure this doesnt happen again by making sure you have enough air circulating in your case and around your hard drive(s). But i honestly think you can stop looking for the cause. I think its been found.

As an aside, i dont like the small usb\firewire enclosures because there is little room for air circulation, even witht the small fan they have, so i keep the case open and the hard drive cooler that way. May not look as cool but the hard drive doesnt burn up either. Either that or use the larger external cases, which i prefer.





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[j3ffr3y]

thanks guys, I guess im just going to go with the 2 hard drive coolers in my current system.. Do they run off the same power source as the hard drives? I dont think I have any more power sources for them if so, I'm running 2 hard drives and a dvdrw.. if this doesnt solve it I'm going to send the thing down a flight of stairs lol. But it usually takes about 3 or so months for me to find out.

I appreciate all the help, this forum is great. I'm glad I found it! thanks again guys.

 

[garebo]

The hard drive coolers i have used all have the molex connector, same as the connector for the hard drive. YOu can buy a connector that will have 2 connectors on the end of it, a splitter, gives you more connections. YOu can add a splitter on another splitter as well, no problem.
You should be ok. There is the slight possibility that your power supply cant handle it but i imagine it will handle the xtra load just fine. But the point is that adding a splitter is a good thing and not a bad thing.
Its done all the time. In order to keep the cost of a power supply down they only put a minimum of these connectors on and many times more are needed, so its common.



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[G0AOZ]

Extra power is usually required to drive the small fan in a hard drive cooler unit. This would typically be 1W or less, so unlikely to put a noticable strain on your existing PSU. The fans are often cabled to a male/female molex connector - one end plugs into the hard drive's power connector, the other takes a single power lead from your PSU. So no extra power lead is required.

ROGER - G0AOZ.

 

[garebo]

I mentioned the splitter because commonly there is not enough length and thus the use of a splitter.


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[Freestone]

but when I get to MyDocuments/*MainUser*/ I get ACCESS DENIED

You must take ownership of these files. See:

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;308421&sd=tech