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Dual processor load balancing
- Thread starter tcstudio
- Start date
marvhuffaker
MIS
That's a pretty typical scenario. Usually the Processor 0 does most the work. But a lot of it depends on what applications you're running and if they're multi-processor capable.
Marvin Huffaker MCNE, CNE
Marvin Huffaker Consulting
Marvin Huffaker MCNE, CNE
Marvin Huffaker Consulting
- Thread starter
- #3
The server is only used for file & printing function with netware 6.5 installed which I believed it to have a lot more multi processor support. But cannot see any ways to customize or tweak the server configuration for the processors to allow me to share the load more effectively. ideally i would like to reduce the threshold level at which the second processor is called upon to be used.
marvhuffaker
MIS
I don't know of any way to do that. Are you concerned because one of them is experiencing a high load? What % utilization are they typically running at?
Normally, with basic file/print, you shouldn't see more than 5-10%.
Marvin Huffaker MCNE, CNE
Marvin Huffaker Consulting
Normally, with basic file/print, you shouldn't see more than 5-10%.
Marvin Huffaker MCNE, CNE
Marvin Huffaker Consulting
In the beginning (Netware 3), only the IPX LAN drivers were SMP (they bought this from the now defunct NETFRAME company).
Then Novell added SMP support for their first web server
and the groupwise server agents.
When the new ZFS/beast NSS file system was developed, it too has SMP support.
When they transitioned from clib to LibC, more and more modules became SMP aware.
In 6.5, I believe every NLM/LAN/DSK can run on any available CPU. Check the MONITOR.NLM set menu for SMP settings.
But think about the job of an SMP developer/OS/App.
At what point do you split a process up?
At the DLL/NLM level?
At the process level?
At the driver level?
How do you let a single DSK or LAN driver "migrate" to additional processors.
Then Novell added SMP support for their first web server
and the groupwise server agents.
When the new ZFS/beast NSS file system was developed, it too has SMP support.
When they transitioned from clib to LibC, more and more modules became SMP aware.
In 6.5, I believe every NLM/LAN/DSK can run on any available CPU. Check the MONITOR.NLM set menu for SMP settings.
But think about the job of an SMP developer/OS/App.
At what point do you split a process up?
At the DLL/NLM level?
At the process level?
At the driver level?
How do you let a single DSK or LAN driver "migrate" to additional processors.
ITsmyfault
IS-IT--Management
Excellent posts.. IMHO 
AFAIK from my reading the docs, in 6.5 every service from the IP Stack on up is SMP compliant. The CPU scheduling issue is a tough one and I agree with bytehd 100%.. it's not like routing where you can do per-packet load balancing.. this is a bit trickier and you don't want to add OH to the scheduler + you can't have different CPU's going after the same memory space etc. All sorts of challenges. Expecting the CPU's to balance always is not realistic IMHO. Most other SMP solutions are *far* less elegant. (windows comes to mind from the OS side, Checkpoint from the app side..) I have not put our new dual CPU boxes into production yet but I'm interested to see how they do vs the 1 CPU ones. I bought the extra CPU (and RAM) for Groupwise.
AFAIK from my reading the docs, in 6.5 every service from the IP Stack on up is SMP compliant. The CPU scheduling issue is a tough one and I agree with bytehd 100%.. it's not like routing where you can do per-packet load balancing.. this is a bit trickier and you don't want to add OH to the scheduler + you can't have different CPU's going after the same memory space etc. All sorts of challenges. Expecting the CPU's to balance always is not realistic IMHO. Most other SMP solutions are *far* less elegant. (windows comes to mind from the OS side, Checkpoint from the app side..) I have not put our new dual CPU boxes into production yet but I'm interested to see how they do vs the 1 CPU ones. I bought the extra CPU (and RAM) for Groupwise.
I agree with Itsmyfault.
Novell was trying to get full SMP for years.
google Jeff Merkey.
He was one of the SMP programmers who jumped ship,
stole Novell IP and started his own clustering company.
Novell won in court.
Anyways, netware has been doing SMP way longer than
Dave Cutler and Linus.......
Novell was trying to get full SMP for years.
google Jeff Merkey.
He was one of the SMP programmers who jumped ship,
stole Novell IP and started his own clustering company.
Novell won in court.
Anyways, netware has been doing SMP way longer than
Dave Cutler and Linus.......
tstudio:
to answer original:
you cant tune windows either.
I mean, did you notice that?
I mean where is the registry entry?
Ive been waiting for these OSes to have something like this:
OS Features: Auto, CPU 1, CPU 2, PErcent slice
Disk features: Auto, Cpu1 , cpu2, percent slice
App features: Auto, Cpu1 , cpu2, percent slice
Ok so now you want SCSI disk on CPU1, 1000baseT on CPU2,
MPEG encoding on CPU1, here come 5000 TCP connections to CPU2 to Apache from the web (through the stack on CPU1).
Get the picture?
These OSes all schedule things dynamically because the kernel knows best whats afloat.
The scheduler says: I have resources, lets dole them out.
The apps, drivers, tasks, services, processes all say:
give me power.
who knows best how to slice and dice?
the kernel.
Ive played extensively with SQL 2000 on a 2 CPU P3-800 Dell.
Poweredge 1400SC.
The profiler and graphical query plans show parallel work
going on, especially where data is on two spindles.
The merge joins etc.
Now who makes the best kernel:
no doubt religious debate of course.
Novell allows code to run.
Cutler and Linus preempt code to prevent lockups.
Novel DEmands good coding.
MS/Linus dont care about wayward code.
But im getting off topic....
MS just put IIS in ring 0.
Whats next? Excel as a SYS driver?
(MS started to "throw all down to ring 0" in the NT days as they realized NT/2000/2003 is a dog without massive caching and more kernel time.
GDI used to be an application.
Now its a kernel driver.
Novell at least lets you set SOME SMP parameters.
MS has one: backrground, foreground. Services or Apps.
Not very granular.
But again, Novell programs for IT gurus.
MS programs for cashiers.
MS: "Only we know how to write and Run (your) code"
Novell: let the code run......if you mess up....we lock up
one favors speed
one favors.....something else
nuff said
flames?
to answer original:
you cant tune windows either.
I mean, did you notice that?
I mean where is the registry entry?
Ive been waiting for these OSes to have something like this:
OS Features: Auto, CPU 1, CPU 2, PErcent slice
Disk features: Auto, Cpu1 , cpu2, percent slice
App features: Auto, Cpu1 , cpu2, percent slice
Ok so now you want SCSI disk on CPU1, 1000baseT on CPU2,
MPEG encoding on CPU1, here come 5000 TCP connections to CPU2 to Apache from the web (through the stack on CPU1).
Get the picture?
These OSes all schedule things dynamically because the kernel knows best whats afloat.
The scheduler says: I have resources, lets dole them out.
The apps, drivers, tasks, services, processes all say:
give me power.
who knows best how to slice and dice?
the kernel.
Ive played extensively with SQL 2000 on a 2 CPU P3-800 Dell.
Poweredge 1400SC.
The profiler and graphical query plans show parallel work
going on, especially where data is on two spindles.
The merge joins etc.
Now who makes the best kernel:
no doubt religious debate of course.
Novell allows code to run.
Cutler and Linus preempt code to prevent lockups.
Novel DEmands good coding.
MS/Linus dont care about wayward code.
But im getting off topic....
MS just put IIS in ring 0.
Whats next? Excel as a SYS driver?
(MS started to "throw all down to ring 0" in the NT days as they realized NT/2000/2003 is a dog without massive caching and more kernel time.
GDI used to be an application.
Now its a kernel driver.
Novell at least lets you set SOME SMP parameters.
MS has one: backrground, foreground. Services or Apps.
Not very granular.
But again, Novell programs for IT gurus.
MS programs for cashiers.
MS: "Only we know how to write and Run (your) code"
Novell: let the code run......if you mess up....we lock up
one favors speed
one favors.....something else
nuff said
flames?
marvhuffaker
MIS
Wow, that was great!
Marv
Marvin Huffaker MCNE, CNE
Marvin Huffaker Consulting
Marv
Marvin Huffaker MCNE, CNE
Marvin Huffaker Consulting
marvhuffaker
MIS
what about it? I don't understand. it's my website.
Marvin Huffaker MCNE, CNE
Marvin Huffaker Consulting
Marvin Huffaker MCNE, CNE
Marvin Huffaker Consulting
I know.
I like it.
Mind if I copy it?
kidding, dcma cops closing in....
Im a novell hack since 1986....... only got my cna 4 though..
drew is retired....ho hum
I like it.
Mind if I copy it?
kidding, dcma cops closing in....
Im a novell hack since 1986....... only got my cna 4 though..
drew is retired....ho hum
marvhuffaker
MIS
If you look at my website, you'll understand. (Not trying to solicit, you brought it up.)
No you can't borrow it
And btw, I was serious, that was a great analysis of MS vs. Novell and SMP. People in general don't understand the complexities involved with running more than one cpu. and they get pissed when they find out that 3 out of 4 aren't even being used and they wasted all that money cause the sales guy said it would help.
Marv
Marvin Huffaker MCNE, CNE
Marvin Huffaker Consulting
No you can't borrow it
And btw, I was serious, that was a great analysis of MS vs. Novell and SMP. People in general don't understand the complexities involved with running more than one cpu. and they get pissed when they find out that 3 out of 4 aren't even being used and they wasted all that money cause the sales guy said it would help.
Marv
Marvin Huffaker MCNE, CNE
Marvin Huffaker Consulting
It would help, if the APP used it.
Novell once ran ad where Qualcomm or somebody had 4000 users on one Netware 4 server.
Dumb but cool.
Talk about pissed off users....
anyways, netware can do more with fewer CPUs.
The old days <1990, it was Oracle query times competing with 'frames. Novell showed a Compaq 4 banger box once that ran some Oracle 6 stuff 4 times faster. Trouble was Oracle used "raw" paritions and timed out the disk channel (read Abended) the server.
Thats when Novell started the SMP march with the MPK stuff.
Im trying to collect it all.....
Ive been trying to dredge up an old Appnote where Drew talks about kernel design, relating it to a short order cook who either lets the burger cook, or keeps swapping the patties, trying to "service more customers".
Anyways, its all in prep for a kernel design book I hope to write someday.
Trying to get Dave Cutler(VMS, NT), Linus (Linux) and superset (Netware) to sit down and chat will not be easy.
But Novell users should be glad you are out there.
meanwhile.....damn small linux kernel tuning goes on at the ranch....
George
Novell once ran ad where Qualcomm or somebody had 4000 users on one Netware 4 server.
Dumb but cool.
Talk about pissed off users....
anyways, netware can do more with fewer CPUs.
The old days <1990, it was Oracle query times competing with 'frames. Novell showed a Compaq 4 banger box once that ran some Oracle 6 stuff 4 times faster. Trouble was Oracle used "raw" paritions and timed out the disk channel (read Abended) the server.
Thats when Novell started the SMP march with the MPK stuff.
Im trying to collect it all.....
Ive been trying to dredge up an old Appnote where Drew talks about kernel design, relating it to a short order cook who either lets the burger cook, or keeps swapping the patties, trying to "service more customers".
Anyways, its all in prep for a kernel design book I hope to write someday.
Trying to get Dave Cutler(VMS, NT), Linus (Linux) and superset (Netware) to sit down and chat will not be easy.
But Novell users should be glad you are out there.
meanwhile.....damn small linux kernel tuning goes on at the ranch....
George
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