DSLmodem > Router> Hub > Server ...right?

[qotyebw]

I'm no network guy, but I have to get DSL going on this network. The modem is installed & connected to the phone line by a pro. Now I get the idea (from previous discussions) that a router is required, instead of directly connecting to the hub. If so, please explain the function of a router.

Also, I do not see a logical link between our network and the ISP. A dial-up connection is a familiar set-up, but how does one "connect" to an ISP using DSL?

Thanks

 

[TheOldMan346]

qotyebw,

Is this a home network? small office? How many computers? What is the connection method (PPPoE, PPPoA, DHCP, static)?

Basically, the router forms a bridge between the internet (WAN) and your internal network (LAN). Its main purpose is to route packets between the WAN and the LAN. It can perform other functions also, such as being a DHCP server and a firewall.

If you are talking about a small number of computers (< 8) get a router with a built in switch. Then you can plug everything directly into the router/switch. If you are talking about more computers, you may need to get a simple router and a couple of switches. Use switches instead of hubs because the price difference is faitly low and the performance difference between a switch and a hub is very significant.

With a DSL router, it is the router that negotiates and maintains the connection with the ISP. It becomes an &quot;always-on&quot; connection. None of the computers need or use the connection software. THey are simply part of the network that is connected to the ISP.

Hope that helps.
The Old Man

 

[jimbopalmer]

A router is only needed if more than one computer is going to share the single IP address the ISP gives you. If the ISP gives you a IP address for every computer you attach, no router is needed.

That said, you may have other uses for you router, they often can be limited firewalls, limited VPN connections, DHCP servers, and DNS caches

While you already have the DSL modem, it is possible to get combo DSL modem/router/switches (I use a Dlink DSL-504) to simplify the clutter in the home.

If needed, the router forms the gateway off the local subnet; as an example

my Macintosh is 192.168.0.13

my subnet mask is 255.255.255.0 (the 255 say it is important, the 0 say it isn't) so I can talk to other macs on the 192.168.0 subnet without the router, but if I try to leave 192.168.0 I need to use my gateway

my Gateway (router) is 192.168.0.1 any traffic other than my local subnet is sent to this address, the whole internet is beyond here
I tried to remain child-like, all I acheived was childish.

 

[qotyebw]

I've read thru many more discussions since posting this, and I've learned a bit more about how it all works. Looks like the Dlink -704 router may be the thing to install... but you raised another question..

There's 8 pc's or more in the office network, but I don't yet know the connection method (PPPoE, PPPoA, DHCP, static). How can I determine this? Will look...

Since we already have a modem and 2 busy hubs ( I THINK they are hubs, with 1 remaining port), I'd rather not replace what's already working. We're using dynamic IP from Earthlink.
Thanks for the nice explainations of the router's job.

 

[jpm121]

In a shared DSL environment, with a router/switch attached to the modem, your client PCs don't worry about PPPoE, the router handles that. You can find the answer to the DHCP question by looking at the TCP/IP properties for the network adapter (varies by OS, but you seem to know what you're doing.) If the properies say &quot;Get IP Address automatically&quot;, you're using DHCP (dynamic host configuration protocol). Otherwise, you'll have a different IP address/subnet mask/gateway defined for each PC. If you don't have a proper &quot;server&quot; then you're likely using static, which is fine.

I'd suggest you look at the option Old Man suggested. It's really cheap (like $100 cheap) and you can still use your hubs for future expansion. Linksys sells a router/switch with 8 ports -- I've had good luck with them.

 

[qotyebw]

Well, I got a Linksys BEFSR41 DSL router with 4-port switch. If connected to a single PC, then I can reach the router's config with a browser. But, not by connecting to the network's hub. Maybe an unseen network security app? How's the best way to check for active security on a network?
Any other ideas?

 

[jpm121]

Errmmm... active security... need some explanation there.

Can the PCs behind the hub ping the router? Ping outside to the internet? If not then I'd suggest your uplink from the hub to the Linksys is set up wrong. I can't remember if Linksys looks for a straight-thru or crossover for uplink ports, can anyone else help?

If they can indeed ping the router, can they access web sites out in the internet? Are they being assigned IP addresses via DHCP?

You're on the right track, just need a little tweaking and you'll be in business.

 

[qotyebw]

I'm rather sure that the router is set-up correctly... Linksys makes it quite clear.
I can't ping the router from any point in the network. Only by pinging directly from one isolated PC can this be done so far. I did not go any further in that mode.
I'm thinking that there MAY be network security in effect, like NIS, that prevents contact with the router. But, why would one un-networked PC still be able to ping the router? Hmmmm.

Users are asking me, &quot;where's my internet?!&quot;. DOH!

Now, to see if I can uncover any network security in effect.....

 

[TheOldMan346]

qotyebw,

I doubt there are any unseen security apps unless you're running a firewall on the computer connected to the hub. I think jpm121 may have a point. How is the hub connected to the LinkSys? Make sure that if you are using the router's Uplink port, that it connects to a standard port on the hub and not the hub's uplink port. A straight-through cable would be used.

The Old Man

 

[qotyebw]

router port 1 to hub port 8 has no effect.
router port 1 to a PC's ethernet card does allow pinging the router.

I wonder, what feature in the network would prevent contact with the router?

 

[TheOldMan346]

gotyebw,

You need to go from router UPLINK port to hub port 8 (hub port 8 MUST NOT be the uplink port) and you must use a straight-through cable. Won't work the way you are doing it.

The Old Man

 

[TheOldMan346]

gotyebw,

Also, using the router uplink port means that router port 1 is NOT usable.

The Old Man

 

[qotyebw]

connecting from the router's UPLINK port to hub port 8 has no effect.
What do you mean by &quot;straight-through cable&quot;?

 

[qotyebw]

never mind that last message... your suggestion worked!
I just had to type the correct IP address.
Now, lets see how far I can get. I still do not understand how the modem will connect to Earthlink. Shows what I know about DSL.

Thanks again..

 

[TheOldMan346]

gotyebw,

You need to configure the router this way
- obtain IP automatically
- make sure DNS, default gateway are blank
- If your ISP is PPPoE, check that. If they are pure DHCP, check disable
- put in User name and Password
- RAS plan - 512K ethernet
- Connect on Demand is OFF
- Keep Alive is ON

The router has the intelligence to make the connection and keep it open.

The Old Man

 

[qotyebw]

Thanks all..
Turns out Earthlink had nothing to do with the DSL.
It helps to have all the right info before proceeding with such projects. We've got static IP from Pac Bell, and with the cables plugged-in correctly, all is well.

The sad part of this project is that the lawyers in the office now have DSL & internet access. I'd prefer they just push paper if anything at all....

Keep on Keep'in on.....

 

[jpm121]

Oh yeah, now the fun can begin -- make sure those virus and script blockers are up to date! LOL

Good luck...

 

[qotyebw]

I just got the call this morning that the users don't have network access. I'm on my way..
Any ideas guys? I guess I'll be going thru the Troubleshooting guide.

 

[qotyebw]

Actually, it's only 3 of 6 users that have DSL yet no network access...
&quot;Domain controller for your domain could not be contacted&quot;

Did not save the orginal IP setting to get them back to previous state. I was hoping that this would be harmless to the network. HA!

 

[qotyebw]

Turns out that those users have only lost mapping to the network drives.
Let's end this discussion, as I start a new topic..

Thanks again..
&quot;It's all for the good of the country&quot;