css menu using display: none considered spam? 1

[annestahl]

Hi All,
I keep reading that text hidden in CSS is considered spam by google (and others). I also read that at best, screen-readers ignore such hidden text. This would mean that we cannot use CSS based drop-down menus!
Does anyone know if this information I'm getting is accurate and correct? If so, is there a way to still use CSS based drop-downs?
thanks
Anne

_________________________________
organic and textured designs for websites that stand out

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[BabyJeffy]

In my experience, the use of display:none doesn't automatically trigger a spam result for your site. If you were to stuff a div full of words to up your rankings, then maybe you would fall foul of their algorithms - but not specifically because you used display:none.

I wouldn't get hung up on this.

Cheers,
Jeff

[tt]Jeff's Page @ Code Couch

http://www.codecouch.com/jeff/

http://www.codecouch.com/jeff/blog/

[/tt]

What is Javascript? FAQ216-6094

 

[BillyRayPreachersSon]

Re. the screen readers, some screen readers try too well to emulate "display:none" by not speaking text styled that way - which is wrong, IMHO.

Although, having said that, if your site has no reader CSS, then you have to live with the reader using your screen CSS.

You might choose to use this instead of "display:none" if that is causing a problem for you:

overflow: hidden;
width: 0px;
height: 0px;
position: absolute;
z-index: -1;
font-size: 1px;
line-height: 0px;

Hope this helps,
Dan

[tt]Dan's Page [blue]@[/blue] Code Couch

http://www.codecouch.com/dan/

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[ChrisHunt]

I keep reading that text hidden in CSS is considered spam by google

Where do you keep reading that? It sounds pretty far fetched to me. There are plenty of sites (including my own) which use [tt]display:none[/tt] in their menus and have been indexed just fine.

screen-readers ignore such hidden text

That probably Is true. Unlike Dan, I think it's correct behaviour - the screen reader is supposed to read out what sighted visitors see. If something can't be seen, it shouldn't be read. Ideally, we'd be able to write @media rules to target screen readers and override this, but my understanding is that they're very poorly supported.

This would mean that we cannot use CSS based drop-down menus!

As noted, lots of people do, it doesn't seem to cause them problems. For safety's sake it may be worgth including a Site Map or some other means to get to every page on the site.

-- Chris Hunt
Webmaster & Tragedian
Extra Connections Ltd

 

[ChrisHirst]

don't worry about it.

I use display:none and do SEO work.
SEO Consultants use display:none on their CSS dropdown

For accessibility you should ensure that the menu is useable for anyone using non-javascript browsers.




Chris.

Indifference will be the downfall of mankind, but who cares?
Woo Hoo! the cobblers kids get new shoes.
People Counting Systems

So long, and thanks for all the fish.

 

[annestahl]

Hi Dan,
thanks for your help. I didn't know about reader css - but am reading up on it now. thanks so much for putting that out there!
Anne

_________________________________
organic and textured designs for websites that stand out

http://www.annestahldesign.com

 

[annestahl]

Chris, (both)
Axandra newsletter often talks about google blocking pages that use 'hidden' text, and I read also that display:none is considered a 'hidden' text. Though I didn't read the two in the same article, which is why I'm wondering if my concerns are correct.
I did contact google with this very question some weeks ago, but have not had word back from them... go figure.
Thanks for your input. I'll keep using them. I think that even IF google considers it spam now, it won't be long before they'll find a way to exclude display:none when used in menus.
thanks for the hint about java script. Any idea if the hover.htc causes any issues???
thanks again,
Anne

_________________________________
organic and textured designs for websites that stand out

http://www.annestahldesign.com