Cat 6 installation, really cat 6? 3

[Dinkytoy]

Hi wondered if any of you guys are able to shed some light on this.

We've recently had our new building fitted out and we specified cat 6 cabling to all points. This was to be installed as part of the fit out.

Separately we had some interrack cat 6 install done by a cable specialist who had nothing good to say about the install being done by the other guys.

We were a little suspicious and got them to do some tests to verify if the work being done by the electricians was to cat 6 standard behind their back. It failed.

Now the electricians have produced a sheet to us showing us that the building is fully cat 6 and to be honest I don't believe them 100%. They used the following device (

http://www.actmeters.com/NETcat-Pro.php)

to check and I don't know enough to know if this can even tell the difference between cat 5 and 5e let alone cat 6.

Is there any easy way to be able to tell if we are being short changed on the install or is there anything to look for in a tester that will be able to tell the difference?

Thanks.

 

[SYQUEST]

Well you can certainly go and inspect the hardware and cable. Read the cable markings on the jacket, that will tell you what kind of cable is being installed. Next remove one of the jack mounting plates, and identify the jacks for make and model. At least you can know if the stuff is rated for Cat 6 hardware wise.

Looking at the link you provided for the cable testing device, The feature list does not include anything about verifying bandwidth on CAT cables or proof of performance. You might want to check around for a company that does Category cable bandwidth verification testing.

....JIM....

 

[vaoldschl]

From what I can see of that tester it is only giving length and continuity. And for $300 I highly doubt it can tell the difference between CAT5, CAT6 or tin cans with string. It's specification sheet only mentions that it "Displays Network Device Capabilities". What exactly does that mean? In comparison, a Fluke that will certify CAT6 goes for over $5K.

There is a lot more involved in meeting the standard than just the materials used, though that is important. I would hire someone (who only does data cabling) to test a random sample of these so-called certified drops. If it was part of the project requirements then any drop that fails would need to be replaced before I cut a check and if the failure rate is high I would fight to have them all replaced.

 

[ttech]

Request printed Certification results, that should put frowns on their faces, because that silly little continuity tester is far from a cable certification Scanner. If I could get by with a $300 tester I would not have bought an $11,000 Fluke DTX-1800m last week to replace our fluke DSP-4100.

 

[Dexman]

ttech is correct. The installation needs to be certified. The required test equipment (like the DTX-1800 series) is expensive, and very few electricians would want to put out that kind of money because low voltage wiring isn't their primary business.

If it ain't broke, I haven't fixed it yet.

 

[clidpri]

first mistake is having the electricians do the install
second mistake is not having an qualified communications company do the install

electricians are electricians, they need to stick to electric work. if they want to install the cable at least let a communication worker do the terminations.
electricians need to get the ______ out of communications

Finally let that be a lesson

 

[jknichols]

the electricians have produced a sheet to us showing us that the building is fully cat 6

If that sheet only said that they used CAT6 wire and jacks, then it is worthless - CAT6 material must be properly installed to maintain the CAT6 qualities.

If it said that all cables were tested with the NETcat-Pro tester, then it is worthless - I checked out the PDF data sheet on the website linked in the OP and while it is supposed to be able to tell if it is connected to a 10Base or 100Base device, it makes no mention of CAT5 let alone CAT6 Certification.

Unfortunately, if your original specifications merely called for CAT6 cable and parts without specifically requiring CAT6 testing/certification, you may be out of luck.

 

[Dinkytoy]

Ok guys thanks for your posts I suspected as much. We're gonna speak to the electricians on Monday and get them to properly test it with a threat of an independant test.

 

[exverizon]

I'm certainly no expert, but what is the practical need for CAT 6? What CPE transmits at speeds beyond CAT 5e specs? Are they operating near plutonium or something? What equipment on the market would fail when transmitting over good CAT 5e drops? Maybe they're just doing future planning, but seems to me if the future bandwidth was in view these customers would just go to fiber and be done with it. How much faster can copper get?

 

[Grenage]

At least 40GB and above; regardless, if you pay for a CAT6 drop...

"We can categorically state that we have not released man-eating badgers into the area" - Major Mike Shearer

 

[macphoneguy]

I would have to echo the previous comments, the wire itself needs to be cat6, the Jacks need to be cat6 rated, i would insist on a tester like the Fluke Cable IQ at minimum as the cable IQ will specifically test for Cat ratings,
"most electricians" don't really know what they are doing when it comes to data com work a few do but not very many and I always insist on checking it myself when it come to low voltage copper just my 2 cents

 

[pbx2sip]

Some self education on the Cat6 standards will help you look for issues that the electricians left at your installation. Did they strip the cables too far back, did they untwist cables excessively, did they since tie-wraps up around cables to make them look nice, did they exceed bend radius, etc, etc. All things that will cause a failure in your testing.

You have gotten great advice here by many - they all agree, you need a real meter designed for testing the entire range of bandwidth available on a cat whatever is being tested. They should be able to print out a report for each and every wire that shows passing the required tests.

If a random sampling is giving you that many issues, its a great sign of things to come.

Heres a link to start with -

http://www.lanshack.com/cat5e-tutorial.aspx

 

[Dinkytoy]

If anyone was interested, the electrical company was forced to make changes to ensure cat 6 certification. They had to change the wall sockets on all outlets at their own cost and do a proper test using a hired tester. All have now passed.

Rather worryingly I've heard that ours was not their first cat 6 install. If nothing else we've at least educated them to the correct methodology in future.

 

[Grenage]

That's good news indeed!

"We can categorically state that we have not released man-eating badgers into the area" - Major Mike Shearer

 

[Dexman]

When I see "wall sockets" I think of AC power. Did the electrical company replaced the jacks ?

If it ain't broke, I haven't fixed it yet.

 

[Mugsiensedgwick]

One more note. Just because it says cat6 does neo tmean it is cat6. Lot's of fakes and knock-offs out there. In the end only a good tester will give you the answer to the question, "Did I get what I paid for?".

 

[RikRodgers]

I don't want to put you on the spot, but I haven't heard of any knockoffs. Do you have any specific brands you'd recommend staying away from?

I've heard that complaint from other techs, usually because the dielectric wasn't the standard cross style, but even those cables have tested to Cat6 standard with a Fluke 4300.

Now if you're talking about 10G Cat6E, or Augmented, that's a different story.

 

[Dexman]

There have been some recent reports about counterfeit cable. 1 such example was bogus Systimax 1071 that was sold in China and was stamped "Made in Australia".

If it ain't broke, I haven't fixed it yet.

 

[RikRodgers]

Thank you, Dexman. I'll keep my eye out.