California C7 license 13

[crooter]

I have been installing phone systems and network cabling for years for Telcomm Companys I was employed with and decided I would do this myself and enjoy a little more of the rewards.

I found out what I needed to do from the State of California and invested $400.00 or so for a contractors study guide, practice tests, a California Contractors License Law and Reference book.

This C7 Study guide is 85 percent Electrical---with topics of Low Voltage exterior lighting, Meters and electrical measurment, Conduit and Electrical wiring codes, Transformers, ohms law and Electrical circuits. Nothing I want to invest my time in to learn----

I guess the questions I am now asking to all who cable:

1. Do other States have the same standards for professionals that want to do Voice/Data/Audio/Video cabling and require that you must know as much or more about Electricity as California?

2. Has this same issue stopped some of you from going into business or pursuing a license in California or other States?

3. Why isnt there a specific seperation between low voltage electrical---and voice data audio and video? For that matter then, anyone that has their MCSE and works indepently, should have a C7 as they deal with the same issues?

Is it just me being upset that in order to go into business for myself in a field that I truly enjoy and am good at, I have to learn a completely different occupation that I dont want anything to do with? I wonder if any of the Telephone/Communication companies I worked for had a C7 license?

I am anxious to hear any of your feedback on this

 

[TouchToneTommy]

Even though the C-7 license covers any low voltage system (anything under 91 volts), learning these systems will help you with troubleshooting telephone systems. It's ALL Ohm's Law! Once you understand that, you will be able to answer any of the low voltage questions on the test. BUT, you should spend a lot of time on the Contract Law portion, Mechanics Liens, etc., as a great portion of the test covers that.

 

[SYQUEST]

Is Michigan's C7 the same as California's C7?

....JIM....

 

[crooter]

I have troubleshot and installed and programmed phone systems and voicemail---and I did just fine without the electrical background--but troubleshooting phone problems is not the point............I am talking about cabling---putting in a new voice/data infrastructure for businesses---

Do you have a C7 License issued by your State Touch Tone Tommy? I am assuming you have at least once, installed a voice and data network---backboard, 66 block/patch panel, home runs to stations, and also presuming that you maintain discipline with following cabling installation standards............How much electrical knowledge---low voltage of course, did you need? (common sense prevails)

If you are a dealer of phone systems, do you have to have a C7 license?

To be honest---I think the C7 should apply to installers of lighting, or lawn watering systems----and a new license created for communications installers.

 

[edfair]

Georgia has the requirement. It is enforced on the general contractors involved with new construction who get electrical contractors to do the AC and accept responsibility for low voltage stuff.

When I've been involved, it has been as a sub responsible to the electrical or assigned to work with them. Or I tell them where I want the drops and I take responsibility for termination.

I decided not to go for a license. Cabling isn't a passion with me, just a thing I sometimes have to do. And the lack of a license hasn't hindered work in older buildings.

I suspect you are frustrated with the license issue and the fact that the requirements haven't kept up with technology.



Ed Fair
Give the wrong symptoms, get the wrong solutions.

 

[crooter]

Ed, I think that hits the nail on the head ---- frustration that it is still lumped with Electrical only because its cooper wire-----Still, I hope many more will respond to this thread and voice their opinions.

 

[TechnCa]

Guy's, I think it might be a good thing in some ways... If they just handed them out the who know's what would happen. I've been working side jobs for years without one. They have these schools you can take for $800 which have good pass rates. I hear the tapes are a good way to beat it in your head too.

 

[franklin97355]

As I see it they are lumped together because the state (not just California) does not have the resourses to make and administer tests for each niche of the profession. What groupings do you think would be fair? Voice/Data, Fire alarm, Environmental monitoring, Audio/Video, Control systems, Hospital call systems, HVAC, Sprinkler control, Landscape lighting. Would you want to pay for and take a test for each type of work you did?

The answer is "42"

 

[crooter]

I think the field is robust enough with voice/data/audio/video---fiber/copper/microwave/wireless---Outside Plant Residential/Industrial/Commercial cabling, etc......... that it should be its own -----
I think electricians do an excellent job and have many dangers--I dont want to be in their field and I dont want them in mine----its that simple---

how would I go about changing the requirements---it has to start somewhere

 

[franklin97355]

I'm not sure I understand your last post. Are you saying voice/data/audio/video is a group and fiber/copper/microwave/wireless is another?

The answer is "42"

 

[crooter]

No--I am saying there is enough areas to be considered its own field or license---that it souldnt be lumped with alarm, electrical or even "low Voltage" anymore

 

[franklin97355]

OK,sorry, I'm still not getting it. What would this "field" be called?

The answer is "42"

 

[crooter]

How about Telecommunications?

 

[bransolo]

what about running pipe for your cable, can you run E.M.T. with a C-7 license. sorry this might not have anything to do with this thread. but i still need the question anserwed. thanks

 

[crooter]

I dont think you need a C7 to run EMT, panduit, conduit--and I dont know of any requirement that says you have to be an electrician to install conduit, its just part of there field, like hanging backboard is a part of ours(or should we get a carpenter)---of course if its a brand new building, I would defer all in-the-wall conduit to the electricians as they are installing it for electrical.

 

[SYQUEST]

You may not need a C7 to install EMT, but Telecommunications these days is a little more than running wire on the baseboard to a jack. The NEC Article 800 deals specifically with Telecommunications, and there are other related section/articles that come into play in the process.

How many do YOU know or know about?

Do you know what NEC requires for an installation?

When I started out years ago in this business I kinda thought the same way, until I had an inspector on a new installation flag a bunch of violations. Since that time I have learned an awful lot of stuff and the proper way to do them in relation to other systems and areas that can be affected by what I do. I am still learning today, with changes going on in the industry.

There are safety issues that alot of people don't realize can happen if a system does not have a proper ground/bond. Then there is liability, I certainly don't want any of my installations or service work to be the cause of someone's injury or accident.

Granted the state may not always keep up with the times, but it is there for a reason.

In regards to the NEC code, I just wonder how many people that participate in this forum have ever read any part of it... (other than "professionals")

....JIM....

 

[crooter]

Syquest

I am not in any way, shape, or form, saying that running cable (voice/Data/Video/Audio) should be a free for all---on the contrary, I am saying that it should be specifically PROFESSIONALIZED towards Telecommunications with a testing process overseen by the State for an issued contractors license and that should be the standard. All business processes apply of course, such as a local business license, liability insurance and bonding, etc.
I am LOUDLY saying that a contractors license should be tailored to our field of expertise and not a small part of anothers occupation.

 

[wires]

>invested $400.00 or so for a contractors study guide

It sounds like you wasted $400.

If you spend money on something then don't take the time to use it it is difficult to call that in "investment".


>This C7 Study guide is 85 percent Electrical ... Nothing I want to invest my time in to learn

We live in a system of laws. Laws are designed to protect everyone. Unfortunately some of these laws only serve to protect those "in the room" from those trying to enter. While you may argue that the C7 license is such a law I would argue that someone running conductors jacketed in noxious chemicals all over a structure needs some regulation.

We all have to learn things that are not directly related to what we want to know. Many times learning these things broadens our horizons and allow you to be happier and more productive over time. Since you have already spent the $$$ why not go ahead and pursue the license? You might the process of getting licensed provides you with additional knowledge and income.

 

[crooter]

Thanks wires---plain and simple---I dont want to be an electrician! Your right--I did waste my $400.00 thinking I would study and prepare for an examination that was written for Voice, Data, Video, and Audio componets and elements. NOT OHMS Law and electrical theory or different types of wire for connecting switches with pilot lights or relays or rectifiers or motor control units.

Thanks for the speech about laws--sounded like Jack Nicholson doing his speech about standing the wall

"Son, we live in a world that has walls. And those walls have to be guarded by men with guns. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Santiago and you curse the Marines. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know: that Santiago's death, while tragic, probably saved lives. And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives...You don't want the truth. Because deep down, in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that wall. You need me on that wall.
We use words like honor, code, loyalty...we use these words as the backbone to a life spent defending something. You use 'em as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide, then questions the manner in which I provide it! I'd rather you just said thank you and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you're entitled to!"

It didnt work for him either!

 

[TouchToneTommy]

Well, then I guess you won't be getting licensed in the State of California. Too bad, as it severly limits you in what you can legaly do, and the protections you have in entering into contracts. Although those other low voltage areas don't directly enter into Voice-Data-Video-Audio, it won't hurt you to gain a broad knowledge of them, just to pass the test. The manner of installing them DOES cross over into the manner of installer V-D-V-A cabling and systems.

If the preperation firm you used is anything like the one I used 15 years ago, most of the questions will be lifted directly from the exam. As I said before, the portion on Contracting Law was a lot harder than the trade portion!