Building gaming PC for my son. Looking for feedback on configuration 4

[pantichd]

Hello,

I am building a gaming PC for my 15 year old son for Christmas. A lot of the games he likes to play just don't work well on the pc he has been sharing with his siblings.

My budget is about $700. I'd love to hear feedback so I avoid mistakes and get the best possible system for the money.

I am also trying to buy everything from newegg because I've always been impressed with their service. Don't want to order from a bunch of different places and chance not getting it in time.

Here's what I have so far:
1) AMD Athlon 64 X2 5600+ Windsor 2.8GHz Socket AM2 Dual-Core Processor
2) MSI K9N4 SLI-F AM2 NVIDIA nForce 500 SLI MCP ATX AMD Motherboard
3) RAIDMAX Sagitta ATX-921WBP Black/Silver SECC Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case 450watt PRESCOTT/ SATA Ready Power Supply
4) I am planning on reusing a 17" monitor, 180GB Seagate and 48X RW DVD drive

I'm looking for feedback on following:
1) The biggest issue I have now is picking a graphics card. I have no clue where to even begin. He is not going to be watching TV with it nor does he need to capture video. So I guess I'm looking for suggestions on good graphics cards for just gaming.
2) I believe that the mobo and processor are compatible but please tell me if you know otherwise.
3) Is the power supply that comes with the case good enough? I've had problems in the past with mobos being very sensitive to the type of power supply. How do you determine what kind of power supply you should use with a specific mobo?

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

David

 

[pantichd]

One other question about this:
I already have a copy of XP that I can install on the new PC but would it be better to run Vista?

Is it OK to ask multiple questions in one post like this? Please let me know if I should break them up into separate posts.

Thanks

David

 

[vacunita]

Ads long as the questions are relevant to each other, or somehow connected, Its actually preferable to ask them in the same thread. if not we'd have clogged forums with different posts by the same person at the same time.

As for your setup, well, I prefer Intel over AMD, but it looks o.k.

You haven't said how much ram your planning on puting in. For gamin I'd suggest no less than 1Gb. an if you are planning on installing Vista then at least 2 to 3GB.

For Video Cards first thing to find out is what kind of expansion slots your chosen MB has. It seas by the link you posted it only has PIC-E slots. So you'll need to look for PCI-E cards. Which at this point is the common interface in the market.

For gaming you'll want at least 256MB, but I suggest no less than 512MB video card. Since you are using a Nvidia chipset. a Nvidia Video card would be the better choice for the better compatibility.


Geforce 8600

Gefroce 8800GT


As for installing XP or Vista. I'd go for XP. but if you want Vista, make sure all the hardware has Vista compliant drivers.

The power source i wouldn't settle for anything under 500W. with the things going in this system, you'll need all the power you can get.










----------------------------------
Ignorance is not necessarily Bliss, case in point:
Unknown has caused an Unknown Error on Unknown and must be shutdown to prevent damage to Unknown.

 

[xwb]

Many games do not work well on Vista. My son talks to a lot of gamers who've installed Vista, found that the game gives all sorts of problems and have gone back to XP.

 

[paparazi]

Here is a list I put together, I believe these are better choices than the ones on the list
CPU

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115030

Motherboard

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130128

Memory (after rebate)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820134066

Case
Your choice but I would be looking for a better quality PSU of 450watts or higher

Graphics card

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150264

Hard Drive

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136073

Just be aware that practically all new motherboards only have the one IDE connector (so 2 IDE devices)

Martin


We like members to GIVE and not just TAKE.
Participate and help others.

 

[paparazi]

This list allows about $80 for a case and PSU. I think Antec sell some cases with there own quality PSU's perhaps not as flash as the one you chose but I'd certainly have more confidence in the PSU over the one chosen.
And as the 8800GT is a lower consuming card than most of the other high performing options a quality 450watter will be sufficient.
Martin

We like members to GIVE and not just TAKE.
Participate and help others.

 

[wahnula]

I also recommend a better PSU, at least 500 watts,
ThermalTake's ToughPower or Antec's EarthPower ar TruePower are good choices.

For a gaming rig, why settle for anything less than nVidia's 8800 series???

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130038

Since it is an SLI board an 8600 GTS is also a candidate if you don't have room for a 2-slot card:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130291

...but it would be difficult for me to justify a slower card for $100...

Tony

"Buy what you like, or you'll be forced to like what you buy"...me

 

[ceh4702]

You cant do it for $700.00. For the newest games you need at least a Nvidia 8800GT at around $300.00. Prices should actually drop after Xmas because the supply is not there to support the demand and it is running the prices up.

If you do not like my post feel free to point out your opinion or my errors.

 

[pantichd]

Thanks everyone for your feedback. It's much appreciated.

Of course, I have some follow-up comments/questions:
1) Power Supply - Based on what I've heard here I'll definitely go for a better one. Is there anything special I should look for in a Power Supply other than watts.
2) I think I know the answer to this, but ... Is there anything special to look for in a case. Obviously, it looks like it has to have a side that can accomodate a fan. Anything else?
3) I asked about XP vs Vista for two reasons:
a) Didn't know if XP really took advantage of the 64-bit processor
b) I thought I read that XP can only recognize up to 4GB of memory. I'm not buying him that much (probably start out with 2GB) but I wanted him to be able to add more later.
4) Processors - Seems like most people like Intel but I didn't go with it because they are MUCH more expensive than AMD. Are they really that much better?

Thanks again for your feedback

David

 

[paparazi]

I'm confused by some of you answers guys:
Why would you want to go for the GTS when the GT is quicker and $80 more? yes even the 256mb model.
Why would you go for an 8600GTS at $5 more than an 8800GT?
Don't you read the threads before posting, the new 256mb version of the 8800GT is $209 so this build can be done for under $700.
Also guys, if you read the reviews these new GT's are using substantially less power so a good quality 450watt PSU will be suficient.
The Intel CPU I picked was just $30 more than the AMD you chose and substantially faster see;

http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/07/16/cpu_charts_2007/index.html

1) It's all about quality so a branded 450watt or higher will be fine.
2)A standard midi ATX case, it doesn't have to have loads of fans, modern CPU's like the E6550 don't produce anywhere like the same amount of heat as CPU's from 2 years ago, heat is not really the issue that it used to be.
ATX means it with accomodate any motherboard conforming to international form factor rules, so practically all.
3) XP because; less compatibility issues with many of the games and because it is not as resource hungry, actually games run quicker.
4)Just take a similar priced Intel CPU, visit Toms CPU charts and compare it to the AMD chip you chose enough said!

Martin


We like members to GIVE and not just TAKE.
Participate and help others.

 

[pantichd]

Martin, you said "so a good quality 450watt PSU will be suficient."

I'm overwhelmed by all the choices. How the heck does one know if it's a good quality PSU?

 

[paparazi]

OK
A good quality PSU! choose from the following brands:
Antec, Enermax, FSP, Coolermaster, Zalman, HEC, Thermaltake, Seasonic, OCZ, Cosair, Hiper, PC power and cooling, Tagan, Gigabyte, CWT (channelwell Technology),
Be quiet there might be one or two more that I haven't included but all the obove brands are known to produce reliable PSU's
Look for a 24pin version 2.2 or newer (see specs)
With the necessary 6pin PCIe graphics card power, SATA power and the 8pin +12volt connectors
Martin


We like members to GIVE and not just TAKE.
Participate and help others.

 

[xwb]

There is XP and XP64. XP is the 32 bit version, XP64 is the 64 bit version. I know it is available on MSDN Universal but I don't know where you can buy it from. Don't know if 32bit games will run on a 64bit machine or if 64bit games will run on a 32 bit machine.

 

[Crowley16]

do not touch xp64, it was a hacked together attempt to get a 64bit os and has a lot of problems and practically no support or drivers. It was never commercially released, more of an experimental os.

As for vista 64, that's still very short on support and is less stable than vista 32.

32 apps can run on 64 bit os, but don't count on it...

--------------------
Procrastinate Now!

 

[pantichd]

I read in a couple of places that people were having trouble with the 64-bit version of XP. That's why I asked.

I tell 'ya, if you don't do this a lot (build high-performance PCs) it can be really overwhelming. The choices are just staggering. Everytime I think I've finally got it something else pops up to make me rethink my choices.

I'm having nightmares about Intel fighting AMD riding 12v rails at speeds of 400MHz through 300GB hard drives powered by 800W PSUs. And that's just in the first couple of seconds. Whew!

David

 

[Crowley16]

there's a approach which I follow whenever I'm specing up a system, but may not be suitable for others...

1) decide on the general performance level you want
2) decide on the money you want to spend
3) revise 1) based on 2), and start looking for components.

4) decide on the core performance hardware you want to use, getting the best you can afford, i.e. if you're going for gamer, then cpu and gpu, but going for heavy data processing then ram or hdd...
5) once you've got the core components you want, then look for a motherboard which will support them all, taking into account the money you have left...
6) then look for the pheripherals
7) then find a psu, you can goto sites which will work out rough Wattage requirements
8) get a case with whatever money you have left

from step 4 - 8, the earlier the step, the more money to be given to the component...

--------------------
Procrastinate Now!

 

[wahnula]

Why would you go for an 8600GTS at $5 more than an 8800GT?

Since it is an SLI board an 8600 GTS is also a candidate if you don't have room for a 2-slot card

As you can see I mentioned it as a single-slot solution. I was under the impression that the GTS model was introduced to be somewhere between the GT and GTX in performance and also more power-efficient. Guess nVidia's Alphabet Soup choked me! I would never challenge Sir Martin in a spec or performance debate! I just bought an 8600GTS for a colleague for Xmas (he does NOT have room for 2-slot card) and I paid $150 for an HDMI-out + DVI -out 8600GTS. The cheapest 8800GT was $279.

Remember the OP posted that he had already procured several components, as I read it. To end the power supply requirements debate, simply Google "Power Supply Calculator" , enter your gear then add 30-35% for upgrades and inefficiencies.



Tony

"Buy what you like, or you'll be forced to like what you buy"...me

 

[dseaver]

What is the best bang for your buck 8800 out right now? I plan on building a new rig in the next few months. I'm thinking about waiting until the nVidia 9 series to come out so that I can try to get an 8800 at a discount. Any thoughts?

I've been outta the building world for a while, but planning to get back into it seeing that my rig right now is 3+ years old and runs a P4, DDR Ram, IDE and AGP. Too many new technologies that I'm not taking advantage of now and been working for the past few months so I have some money.

Also, is it safe to say that at the current time I should go with an Intel over an AMD?

 

[wahnula]

dseaver

You have a LOT of options. I would recommending starting a new post with your requirements for how the PC will be used, then starting with a CPU & chipset recommendation and going from there. Right now Intel wears the performance crown, but AMD is better/cheaper in the midrange/budget sector.

Tony

"Buy what you like, or you'll be forced to like what you buy"...me

 

[kmcferrin]

You cant do it for $700.00. For the newest games you need at least a Nvidia 8800GT at around $300.00. Prices should actually drop after Xmas because the supply is not there to support the demand and it is running the prices up.

Absolutely untrue. Look at this thread:

http://www.tek-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=1435519

It's got a rockin' system for a tad under $800. If pantichd isn't going to need to buy a hard drive then that takes it to almost exactly $700. If they want to save even more money they could get a slightly less expensive CPU.

do not touch xp64, it was a hacked together attempt to get a 64bit os and has a lot of problems and practically no support or drivers. It was never commercially released, more of an experimental os.

As for vista 64, that's still very short on support and is less stable than vista 32.

32 apps can run on 64 bit os, but don't count on it...

Also absolutely untrue. Windows XP is great for gaming. I would avoid Windows XP 64-bit though, only because the driver support for a lot of niche devices isn't there and isn't likely to ever show up. The 64-bit Windows XP (talking about the x64 edition here, not Itanium) WAS commercially released about two years ago as an OEM only release, chiefly because there are so few drivers available for it. Microsoft felt that if it was OEM only then the OEMs could select the hardware and provide the necessary drivers, and the support would fall on the OEMs. With a full retail release there would be a lot of headaches from people who didn't know what they were doing who bought a 64-bit OS and the support would fall on Microsoft.

Crowley16 says it's a hacked together attempt at an OS, but it's actually built on the Windows Server 2003 SP1 x64 Edition code base and it is extremely stable.

Unless you know what you're doing, I would stay away from Vista for now. It does have some teething problems, though it has been pretty trouble-free on my laptop and home desktop. However, it does run games a little slower than XP did, so many gamers are sticking with XP.

The 64-bit version of Vista is roughly the same as the 32-bit version because Microsoft changed the rules a bit with Vista. A vendor cannot get an application or piece of hardware Vista logo certified unless it works correctly on and has drivers for both 32-bit and 64-bit versions of the OS. Vista x64 is much better than XP x64 in this regard.

However, if you don't have or plan on having more than 4GB of RAM there is no point in running the 64-bit OS. In fact, there are some potential drawbacks. While 32-bit applications work fine on 64-bit versions of Windows there is no support for 16-bit applications, not even via emulation. So 16-bit applications that ran just fine on 32-bit XP or Vista will not run at all on the 64-bit version. On top of that, many companies that produced 32-bit applications still used old, 16-bit software installers. If you're using older software this presents a problem where the application might actually work just fine on a 64-bit version of Windows, but you'll never be able to install it to find out.

Back to the OP's questions:

Intel vs AMD - It's like being a Republican or a Democrat. Everyone has their favorite. If you want the fastest system that you can buy then it's Intel you'll be wanting. But if you're trying to keep it under $700 then you're not going to get the fastest system that money can buy. At the lower end, the performance is roughly comparable for the same dollar amount spent. If you're trying to put together the cheapest PC that you can manage, it will likely be AMD though.

On 64-bit processors: Modern CPUs can run either 32-bit or 64-bit operating systems. 32-bit Windows has a limit of 4GB of RAM. 64-bit Windows goes much higher (I think technically to 1TB, though you can't buy memory like that yet). Unless you plan on using more than 4GB of RAM there is no reason to get a 64-bit OS. If you are going to use exactly 4GB of RAM you really don't need a 64-bit OS.