Better Software

[david7777777777]

Merlin has helped me tremedously as have others here. Thank you very much for your help. But....

I have to believe that this whole web-to-database concept had been around long enough now for there to be development tools that are more mature than VI. An example of what I'm talking about: I cannot believe that tweaking a databse query using the recordset DTC requires so much hand coding, especially if you want the recordset to display a message if the search results are null.

I'm sure we all have our own definitions of "so much hand coding." But there's got to be some develoment tools out there that do all or most of this coding for you, like FrontPage does for HTML coding. No FrontPage remarks please, it's only the concept to which I am referring. Am I wishing for too much? Is this web-to-database concept still too new to expect more mature development tools today? Does anyone know of one where little to no hand coding is needed to do just about anything with your database via ASP pages?

If you haven't guessed I'm not what most of you would consider a real programmer. I'm a Network Administrator who is developing ASP pages (with tons of on-the-fly education)when I have time while I juggle several projects and I need something that will do all of this @#$%! coding for me like FrontPage does for an HTML developer. I know what I want my app to do, but is all this hand coding the best we can do today? I've got to be missing something here, someone please knock some sense into me. Maybe I'm just trying to do too much at once.

 

[v0520]

From what I have seen with Visual Interdev 6.0 dtc's and the like, you will run into problems. You are much better off using something like ado to connect to your database from the web server and then generating html to send back to the client.
Try using the Response object to generate appropriate html to send back to the client.

I do not place much value in a lot of these "whiz-bang" tools because I have found you will waste a lot of time tweaking it to get it to do exactly what you want to do.
If you generate html code (or dhtml) or what have you, you can control exactly what you wanted to do in the first place.

Gilbert M. Vanegas
Programmer Analyst III
County of San Bernardino - ISD
Email : gvanegas@isd.sbcounty.gov

 

[dilettante]

Hire a programmer? ;-)

 

[david7777777777]

Surely you jest, that would be logical and efficient!

 

[DavidJA]

I have found that every single MS tool that attempts to code for you generates horrable code!

eg: Interdev; FrontPage; SQL Server's stored procedure wizard; VB's data enviroment; and the list goes on and on. (Macromedia's dreamweaver can generate some horrable code as well!)

Honistly; I can not find a need to even use interdev's DTC. What I do is I have a COM component written in VB (source available; just e-mail me!); which returns a recordset.

Then buiding a table based on this recordset is easy!

Set rs = myComComponent.GetRecordset(strSQL)

If (rs.eof and rs.bof) then
response.write(&quot;<P>No records returned</P>&quot
else%>
<table>
<%Do until rs.eof%>
<tr>
<td><%=rs.fields(&quot;Field1Name&quot%></td>
<td><%=rs.fields(&quot;Field2Name&quot%></td>
</tr>
<%rs.movenext
loop%>
</table>
<%end if%>

Adding functionality to this is easy! For example; A-HREF the cells in the top row for sorting; using the rs.sort method.

The above is fairly breif; let me know if you want more detailed info.

 

[david7777777777]

I agree, but with the limited amount of time I have to devote to this ASP project, I'd take junk code over clean code as long as it provided the functionality I need. I need to lobby for a 36-hour day. Thanks for the help!

 

[MerlinB]

I used a great web tool from Centura-now-Gupta (

http://www.centurasoftware.com)

some years ago. It created query, list, add/update/display forms against any database, which you could adjust. Very simple, but it worked. This product was sold off to another company - I saw it listed in one of the QBS-Software catalogues (

http://www.qbssoftware.com)

- but now I forget its name or new owner. Take a look at WebApp Studio (

http://www.dataaccess.com)

or similar.

Or you could try purchasing improved design-time-controls. There are a few around with loads of extra facilities. The ones supplied with VI were just a taste of the possibilities. [The anti-DTC mob are clearly not keen on fast and flexible development].

Or you could try .Net - which extends the DTC idea to a much more mature and flexible product.

Or you could try some of the bigger e-commerce development studios - but you may find that they drain your money reserves (IBM-Websphere etc.).

As with anything - it takes time to figure out what everyone wants from a 'general-purpose' tool. At least with ASP/DTC's you can extend objects in the way that YOU want.

http://www.websitedesign.co.uk

http://www.zentext.com

(Content Management)

 

[cbokowski]

Have any of you seen what VisualStudio.Net does/can do? I went to a developer seminar and from what I was shown hands down it beats the current M$ solution.

 

[david7777777777]

Thanks a lot Merlin, this helps tremendously.

 

[david7777777777]

Merlin,
Do you know who sells the improved DTC's? I'm having difficulty finding anyone who sells them on the Internet. Thanks.

 

[MerlinB]

I agree, there is not very much. I'm sure I found some others several months ago. The big VB control developers [e.g. Component One (

http://www.componentone.com)

/ Sheridan (www.infragistics.com)] are doing controls for [ASP].Net.
There is a new arguement going on that Flash/SOAP is going to largely replace HTML as the front-end... (

http://www.devx.com/free/hotlinks/2001/ednote121901/ednote121901.asp).

Search using google...
these may help:

http://www.aspxtras.com/pr/VisualWebGrid3.asp

http://www.ermas.com/components/

Very powerful, but not DTC's...

http://www.dbnetgrid.com

or

http://www.aspgrid.com

interesting:

http://home.worldonline.dk/~viksoe/easyhtml.htm

for charting:

http://www.hallogram.com/webcharts/

not quite the right thing:

http://www.jagat.com/Products/jtScroll/Default.htm

http://www.websitedesign.co.uk

http://www.zentext.com

(Content Management)