Back from holiday, PC doesn't boot any more

[pmonett]

Hmm. I come back from a week off and find that my 2nd home PC doesn't POST anymore.
If I unplug the video card (an X850 - leave it in the slot but remove the additional power connector), I get a clear message on screen asking for said plug to be reinserted. Once that is done, however, on reboot the PC doesn't even get to the point where it displays anything.

The config is as follows :
ASROCK 939 Dual Sata motherboard
AMD XP 4000
ATI Radeon X850
2 GB DDR
2 x 200GB IDE HDDs (7200 RPM)
2 x DVD-RW
500W PSU

I tried clearing the CMOS, to no avail. There is no fan problem, as the disks boot and the fans whirr. The optical devices go through their normal blinking, then nothing.

I have the BIOS report SMART info on each startup, info that I read regularly. There is no reported disk issues - at least not from SMART.

I'm wondering - could the graphics card be at fault ? Could there be an issue with one of the HDDs despite SMART not reporting anything ? Could the PSU be going down the drain ?

Any suggestions ? Questions ?

Pascal.


I've got nothing to hide, and I'd very much like to keep that away from prying eyes.

 

[ski]

The monitor appears to be ok, since it displays a message when the video card is removed.

Install/connect only the power supply, MB, CPU, memory, video card, monitor, and keyboard.

If no luck, then place the MB on a piece of cardboard. If there's now a display, then the MB is shorting out. Check for a loose screw, standoff, etc., inside the case, and also remove any standoffs which do not line up with MB holes. If none is found, then remove all MB screws and metal standoffs, and install paper washers(manila folder paper works good for this) between the MB and the screws/standoffs.

If there's no display with the MB placed on a piece of cardboard, then proceed with the following:

(1) Test the PS as described here:

http://www.ochardware.com/articles/psuvolt/psuvolt2.html

If you do not have a voltmeter, then try a different PS.

(2) If the PS voltages are ok or there's no display with a different PS, then remove and reinsert the memory a few times making sure it's firmly seated, install the memory modules one at a time in different slots, and make sure the video card is firmly seated.
If still no display, then either swap out the MB, CPU, memory, and video card, or have them tested to find out which one is defective.

 

[kmcferrin]

For the record, unplugging the secondary power connector on a modern video card is not the same as unplugging/disabling the video card. It will still draw power from the AGP/PCI-E slot, just not enough for full operation. As to whether that can cause excessive draw on circuits for AGP/PCI-E, I don't know. But it's not a good idea. If you want to unplug a video card (or test without video), then you need to truly remove the card from your system.

 

[kjv1611]

Try removing the video card, then see if it boots up, and tell us what it says on your monitor.

--

"If to err is human, then I must be some kind of human!" -Me

 

[pmonett]

Thank you for your replies.
My point in mentioning the power connector on the video card was to demonstrate that the screen did not have a problem and that the video card was not entirely dead.
If I remove the video card from the slot, I doubt there will be much to see on the screen as far as error messages are concerned .
I will try disconnecting the IDE units and find out whether that makes a difference.

Pascal.


I've got nothing to hide, and I'd very much like to keep that away from prying eyes.

 

[kjv1611]

Yeah, I just meant the part about seeing what's on the screen as a joke. I had been reading of some practical jokes, and couldn't resist mentioning that. But, you could see if the machine seems to boot (fans, hard drive, case speaker) without the VGA to see if that helps in any way at all...

--

"If to err is human, then I must be some kind of human!" -Me

 

[pmonett]

Okay, bad news overall.
I removed the motherboard from the casing, isolated it from any metallic contact, and plugged in the bare necessities to boot the PC (disk, keyboard, mouse, graphic card).

It didn't.
Fans turn, but nothing more gets done.
I doubt the CPU is at fault, or the RAM.
The graphics card has no reason to die like that, it's running at stock frequencies and always has.
The discs should not be at fault given that there was no SMART warning.
That leaves me with either the motherboard, or the PSU.

I'll have to try with another PSU to make sure it's the motherboard.

Grrr.

Pascal.


I've got nothing to hide, and I'd very much like to keep that away from prying eyes.

 

[ski]

Actually, you do not want to connect the HD or mouse in a barebones setup. Only the components I mentioned.
Also, you cannot just guess at what may or may not be causing the problem. Troubleshooting a "No Display" problem has to be an organized, step-by-step process.
Did you reseat the RAM and video card, and try each RAM module one at a time in each of the slots as suggested?

 

[pmonett]

I did actually, since I had to remove all that to get the motherboard out of the case in the first place. Well I didn't try the RAM one by one.

But I do not think I am just guessing yet. I have never had a CPU die on me, nor RAM nor any video card I have ever had.

I have, on the other hand, lost 2 hard disks to failures of the logic board, and I have lost three motherboards, two of them to unknown factors (one morning they just didn't start up any more - the last one got zapped by a power surge).

Given the above, and after I took two hours to do the additional tests, my gut feeling is that the motherboard is gone, so I need a PSU to confirm it.

I am not happy though, a 939 motherboard is not going to be easy to find today, and I don't have the money to do a full upgrade now.

Grrr.

Pascal.


I've got nothing to hide, and I'd very much like to keep that away from prying eyes.

 

[pmonett]

Okay, I have another update :

I removed the video card and replaced it with a good ol' AGP card that I still have (my wife calls me a packrat). I also found a 400W PSU with the proper connector for the motherboard.

Having stringed it all together, I hooked up the mains and pressed the button. The disks whirred, the fans turned, but the screen remained desperately dark.

I tried again without the disks, same result.

So, in the end, the mainboard with the CPU and two bars of RAM, plus and old AGP card and a 400W PSU still does not boot. I think that just about wraps the case.

I'm going to order a new 939 mainboard.

Thanks for all the ideas !

Pascal.


I've got nothing to hide, and I'd very much like to keep that away from prying eyes.

 

[kjv1611]

For your 939 mobo, if you want to save some cash, you can probably find a used one from a good eBayer for cheap. I have now done that on at least 2 or 3 occasions, and not a bad one yet. Of course, I've been careful of whom I bought from. I've not been so lucky with some other items, but that was really b/c of my stupidity of not following the one important rule:

If it sounds too good to be true, then it probably is.

--

"If to err is human, then I must be some kind of human!" -Me

 

[kmcferrin]

There are tons of 939 boards still available, and most of them are pretty inexpensive:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...&Subcategory=22&description=&Ntk=&srchInDesc=

 

[pmonett]

Thanks for the tips, but I live in France. As such, if Ebay is a possibility, I avoid it like the plague (don't trust PayPal). And Newegg is not an option either.

But don't worry, there are enough french-based sites for me to find something.

I hope.



Pascal.


I've got nothing to hide, and I'd very much like to keep that away from prying eyes.

 

[kjv1611]

Should've guessed from the name.

--

"If to err is human, then I must be some kind of human!" -Me

 

[acewarlock]

I have been using Ebay and PayPay for 10 years and have spent over $15,000 and I've only lost $25 on 1 transaction where I didn't get the item and 1 $5 item that didn't work. I've Been using online banking for more than 20 years, so whats your problem with them.

 

[kmcferrin]

I'm not why you seem to take it personally that Pascal doesn't trust eBay or Paypal, but he is hardly the first person to have had issues with it. In the past, PayPal was notorious for taking peoples' money and not releasing it at even the slightest notion that there might be something inappropriate going on. There used to be a number of web sites detailing thousands of stories of people getting taken advantage of by PayPal. Most of them centered around PayPal giving people the impression that they were a bank because they acted like a bank, but then not giving their users any of the protections or due process that they would be entitled to had they actually been a bank.

At any rate, I am extremely skeptical of your claims. The Internet has only been open to commercial development for 22 years, and the World Wide Web didn't exist until 1991 (and even then, only at CERN). I doubt that your bank was an early adopter of the the whole "Online Banking" thing and invented some proprietary protocols for it that ran over ARPANet to serve their customers who couldn't even access the network yet.

And for the record, PayPal didn't exist until the year 2000. And the companies that merged to form PayPal in 2000 didn't exist until 1999, so I'm doubtful of those claims as well. Though eBay was founded in 1995, so you certainly could have been using it for 10+ years.

 

[kjv1611]

kmcferrin, again you make some very good points. It's amazing how far exaggerations can be stretched.


I can say I've used eBay and Paypal now for almost 5 years now, and have used Paypal the whole time. I much prefer Paypal to other methods with eBay, as it has come in handy on a couple of occasions where someone did try to rip me off.

But overall, my experience with both as a buyer (and very seldom) as a seller, has been pretty good. Not crazy about the eBay fees, but then again with the audience you get, it's hard to complain there as well.

Regardless, I say to each his/her own. If you don't want to use eBay and/or Paypal, then don't use it. In my opinion, the fewer people who use eBay, the fewer people I have to bid against.

--

"If to err is human, then I must be some kind of human!" -Me

 

[acewarlock]

Online banking wasn't with a bank, is was with a conpany called CHECKFREE CORP and if you check on Google you will find they started in 1981, so I don't think I'm exaggerating. PayPal was founded in 1998, so again am I exaggerating. I started doing computer programming in 1964, so I guess you will say there weren't any computers back then.

PS I wasn't taking it personally.

 

[kjv1611]

Hmm, now I may just have to go and look all this up - maybe. This has gotten me rather curious. It's like we're playing PC Jeopardy here, only it's not that a PC is in jeopardy[/], but that Alex Trebek needs to be here to ask some questions.

--

"If to err is human, then I must be some kind of human!" -Me

 

[pmonett]

My reasons for not wanting to trust PayPal are my own business. If you're happy with it, good for you.

Pascal.


I've got nothing to hide, and I'd very much like to keep that away from prying eyes.