ADD MEMBER - EXPAND VOLUME - OR EXTEND PARTITION ?? 1

[dciadmin]

DELL POWEREDGE 4600
WINDOWS 2000 SERVER SERVICE PACK 4
OPENMANAGE ARRAY MANAGER 3.5

Have array set up like this (how it shows in array manager)
array group 0
winnt2000 0 (disk 0) raid-5 20.00gb
dciweb 1 (disk 1) raid-5 35.8gb
dciapps 2 (disk 2) raid-5 4.00gb
dcifolders 3 (disk 3) raid 5 8.00gb

disks
disk 0 (winntnt2000 0) basic disk
disk 1 (dciweb 1) dynamic disk
disk 2 (dciapps 2) dynmaic disk
disk 3 (dcifolders 3) dynamic disk

volumes
dci apps (f: dynamic simple volume
dci folders (g: dynamic simple volume
dci web (e: dynamic simple volume
dci server (c: basic primary partition

have 3 drives (36gb) with the above specs. Have 4 more unused drives that are also 36gb and I have the slots for them and mounting hardware. Ideally I would like to add more space to the f: volume (only has about 9gb available) and more space to the g: volume (also has about 9gb left). Would then probably consider creating volume H: for the other two drives.

I don't quite know how to start ... I see options for adding space by adding to the virtual disk (add member), expanding a volume, and extending a partition (which I don't think you can do on a raid 5 ??). What is the difference between the options and how does it affect the end result? I really am just looking to get more space on the volumes listed and create another area for seperating files that will belong to our new design software. It looks like there are virtual disks for each volume ?? Would I be expanding or adding member or .....???????

Can anyone explain this in duh terms to me? I appreciate any help,

jsl-dci

 

[NickFerrar]

You should just be able to add the new disk into the current array and then expand the volumes you want to get bigger.

Couldn't find one of our servers with Win2k and Array Manager v3.5 but on v3.4 the procedure is:
1). Insert new disk(s) into server
2). In Array Manager drill down to Arrays->PERC Subsystem->PERC Controller->Array Group 0 and right click on Virtual Disk 0 (assuming you really have configured as one container). On the right-click menu select 'Reconfigure...' and a config window pops up. On the left side you should see the current three disks listed (and ticked) and the newly added disks listed but unticked, if the new disks don't show then reboot the server and get back to this point.
3). Tick the disks to add to the array, make sure the RAID type remains at RAID-5. I think you then have to manually state the size of the new array (as you don't have to use all the available space in a single array but you do in this case).
4). Once you hit OK the server goes off and reconfigures the array (without losing your current data) which can take several hours, it's also best done when the server is being used much as it's I/O intensive.
5). After the reconfiguration completes go back into Array Manager and into Disk View and you should be able to adjust the volume sizes, if the new disk space doesn't show up then reboot the server and it should show after.

 

[dciadmin]

thanks for the reply Nick ... can you answers a couple questions though so that maybe I will start seeing how this all works?

You say to go to array 0 and then right click on Virtual Disk 0 ... why virtual disk 0 and not one of the ones that I am planning on adding space to? Or does it really matter at this stage because I am only adding them to the array group? I guess my confusion comes with some of the terminology ... when do you use "add member" for a virtual disk? Wouldn't adding space to what looks like virtual disk "dcifolders 3" be done by adding more members to it?

I also assume that I will have to make these new disks dynamic before I reconfigure? Also heard something about that if you expand a volume you loose the benefit of redundancy of your Raid ... one disk fails and the raid fails??

Thanks for all the help and patience. It is appreciated,

jsl-dci

 

[NickFerrar]

The virtual disk is the RAID container, looking back at your first post if those are virtual disks you've talking about then it's not a good configuration. You bascially have multiple RAID containers sharing the same physical disks which can cause problems.

In this case just add one physical disk to the F: cvirtual disk, one physical disk to the G: physical disk. For H: though you're a bit stuck as you only have two drives left, you could just create a RAID-1 mirror for it.

I don't think you can span a volume across separate virtual disks, if not the only option if you want to keep RAID-5 is to create a second RAID-5 virtual disk with the 4 spare drives, create volume H: with how much space you want and then use volume mount points from F: and G: to reference the remaining space on the new RAID-5 container (you'd create an I: drive I guess).

Next time you config RAID though just create one big RAID-5 container and use Windows volumes to divide up the space, rather than creating multiple RAID virtual disks. Ideally the OS would be on it's own RAID-1 virtual disk though.

 

[dciadmin]

Any way to confirm that there is indeed multiple containers or are you sure that that is the case from what I posted before?

I thought that if I had multiple raids then this would show as seperate array groups. What is strange though is the capacity of the "volumes" that were created. The array disks capacity shows 33.92GB capacity for each of the three disks but the space capacity showing for each seems to be spread out over multiple disks (one is 35.80). Yet, like you say, it seems like they are seperate containers on each disk. How could that be so?

 

[NickFerrar]

I don't actually know what creates array groups, never dealt with a system with more than 1 before. Multiple virtual disks is definetly multiple RAID containers though.
You can create them by creating a RAID-5 container but not using all the space available (e.g. on your 3x34GB drives that gives roughly 68GB useable in RAID-5, if you create a container with only 35Gb though you can create a second container, using the same set of physical disks of 33GB - or in your case multiple small containers).
I think whoever set up the RAID on your system didn't fully understand what they were doing as you're not gaining performance from this, you're just adding complexity to the configuration.

 

[dciadmin]

Should I assume then that even though each virtual disk appears to be its own raid and each raid seems to list the one disk that it is on ... wouldn't each raid be still writing to all 3 disks using one of them as parity? For now, the added complexity may be fine if the raids themselves are still safe (one disk can go down and not kill the whole raid for example).

I will most likely add a drive to each raid container as you suggested last. This will give me the space needed for now. I have 2 other servers that are running raid 5 that I need to look at but they were setup differently and neither has an array manager setup in windows (the regular disk management doesn't have much for information). I will get a manager on them and see how they were done for comparison .... they were done by different people

thanks again for the support. It is pointing me the direction I need to go ...

JSL-DCI

 

[NickFerrar]

Hmm each virtual disk should expand and show the 3x34GB physical drives beneath (as 'Array Disk 0:0' etc.). If only one physcial drive displays under each Virtual Disk then either there's a bug in Array Manager so it's not displayed correctly or you haven't got RAID (although I wouldn't expect it to show as a Virtual Disk then either...).
In your config in theory if one drive fails you should still be OK as you're not mixing RAID levels over the same set of disks - it's still not recommended though.

 

[dciadmin]

I see what you are saying ... I think that I am just adding to the confusion. Under perc subsystem 2 .. under array group 0 .. it shows the 3 array disks 0:0 to 0:2 and then shows what I now see as the 4 seperate raid containers (as listed above .. first message). Each of these does expand to show all the array disks under them. I guess I just expected that same information to show under the "Disks" section of the array manager as well. In there if I right click on a disk and properties I get a virtual disk name like "DCIFOLDERS 3" and then a disk name of "Disk 3" and layout of "Raid-5". This led me to be think that each one was seperate.

We have tended to setup a lot of our systems in a "not recommended" way. Both a lack of knowledge and lack of resources I think. At some point I will take a look at perhaps a rebuild but for now most likely will add a drive (maybe 2) to two of the raids.

Thanks for the advice and for setting me straight.

JSL-DCI

 

[dciadmin]

I added one of the drives today and then did a rescan (hot swap - have not rebooted the server). Drive came up and shows as array disk 0:9 in arrays and virtual disk 4 (disk 4) in the disk section. Array manager said it was a foreign disk and it needed to be merged in order to use on this system (this disk came out of one of our other servers during an upgrade). So I merged the disk. It now shows up in windows explorer as drive H: and has folders on it from the previous server.

Properties under the disk section show it as raid-0 and will allow me to create a volume. However under arrays I can't seem to reconfigure one of the existing containers and add the new drive. Doing a reconfigure on any of the containers only shows the original 3 drives with check marks in them (the new drive is a no show). Any idea as to what I am missing in order to add it to my F: or G: containers?

Do I need to create a volume first or perhaps it needs formatting? Am I stuck adding another drive and trying to mirror it? Seems like my options are not showing with this drive.

 

[NickFerrar]

I think you need to initialise that 'new' drive (either at the RAID card BIOS level or through Array Manager). It sounds like the PERC picked up the config from the old server and thinks it's part of a RAID container already so it doesn't allow it to be used in other containers.

 

[dciadmin]

Yeah I would have tried that but the initialize is disabled in the array manager. I will try to do it thru the bios when I can take the server down. Kind of defeating my reason for installing array manager at this point ... to avoid having to keep downing the production server.

thanks Nick .. Maybe I will come back tonight and try that out. Don't think I have the time to wait til the weekend ...